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Crystallas
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Re: Would you avoid Obamacare on principle?
Reply #10 - Mar 16th, 2014 at 5:00pm
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Shiva_TD wrote on Mar 16th, 2014 at 8:03am:
I don't see how this makes sense. Obviously if you have less than 50 full time employees you wouldn't be affected by Obamacare at all. As for subcontracting the work out it will cost more than the cost of providing the insurance and doing the work in-house.


The ACA doesn't count the number of full-time employees, but the equivalent of 50 full-time employees(which is nothing for what I do). For my business, it's easier and most cost effective to contract because of the ACA, nearly a 14% savings to my business when all breaks and added taxes are included(even including the fact that I would require another employee just for accounting that could have been better utilized elsewhere). One thing you n00bs to business should learn, every business and industry is different, so "obviously" you would not understand, nor should it make sense to you, since your interests are elsewhere.
  
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Jeff
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Re: Would you avoid Obamacare on principle?
Reply #11 - Mar 17th, 2014 at 1:39pm
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Shiva_TD wrote on Mar 16th, 2014 at 7:45am:
The US Supreme Court has already ruled that the "tax" (fine) is Constitutional so there aren't grounds for a lawsuit.

Well, since it is a 'tax', and it's a Direct tax that would be levied without apportionment, that would be a fine basis for a lawsuit.
  
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Jeff
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Re: Would you avoid Obamacare on principle?
Reply #12 - Mar 17th, 2014 at 1:48pm
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Shiva_TD wrote on Mar 16th, 2014 at 8:03am:
I'm not sure why so many seem to be incapable of creating a business plan that provides adequate compensation in wages and benefits for their employees while still allowing the enterprise to achieve a very good profit on the goods and/or services provided.

Almost anyone can create a plan like that, the problem is, people aren't always willing to pay what you need to sell for, and often, competition arises that undercuts your asking price, or your employees aren't as productive as you hoped, or the economy turns down and your sales taper off, or some new government regulation raises the cost of doing business, or the cost of your raw materials goes up... in short, it takes lots more than just a good plan up front to create and maintain a successful business.
  
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Shiva_TD
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Re: Would you avoid Obamacare on principle?
Reply #13 - Mar 18th, 2014 at 8:58am
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Crystallas wrote on Mar 16th, 2014 at 5:00pm:
The ACA doesn't count the number of full-time employees, but the equivalent of 50 full-time employees(which is nothing for what I do). For my business, it's easier and most cost effective to contract because of the ACA, nearly a 14% savings to my business when all breaks and added taxes are included(even including the fact that I would require another employee just for accounting that could have been better utilized elsewhere). One thing you n00bs to business should learn, every business and industry is different, so "obviously" you would not understand, nor should it make sense to you, since your interests are elsewhere.


It is true that every business is unique but I would make the argument that simply subcontracting the work out to another company that is providing the health insurance to their employees does not reduce your costs but actually increases them.

Once again I only ran the numbers for my enterprise and estimate the cost of providing health insurance to be about $1.50/hr per employee (they will have a copay for the insurance). With my starting wage (for manufacturing) being $20/hr that only represents a 7.5% increase in compensation and even less considering that some of my employees will be earning up to $30/hr. Additionally it will only represent a 1.8% increase in the cost of sales based upon billing at $80/hr for labor excluding the additional costs of materials and subcontracted work that are added to the "sales price" of the goods I will be selling.

And I can still earn a substantial profit from the enterprise based upon the business plan. I will earn far more from the in-house labor than I will from the subcontracted work where I'll only take a 10% profit from subcontracted work.

But, as noted, every business has it's own unique requirements and even I will depend upon sub-contracting initially until I can build the sales to the point to move most of the work in-house. I won't actually pocket any of the initial profit from the subcontracting as the profits are going to be re-invested into the business so that I can move the work in-house because that's where the real money is.
  
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Shiva_TD
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Re: Would you avoid Obamacare on principle?
Reply #14 - Mar 18th, 2014 at 9:01am
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Jeff wrote on Mar 17th, 2014 at 1:39pm:
Well, since it is a 'tax', and it's a Direct tax that would be levied without apportionment, that would be a fine basis for a lawsuit.


It's based upon the income tax laws under the 16th Amendment tht don't require apportionment and the case has already been heard by the US Supreme Court.
  
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Shiva_TD
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Re: Would you avoid Obamacare on principle?
Reply #15 - Mar 18th, 2014 at 9:15am
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Jeff wrote on Mar 17th, 2014 at 1:48pm:
Almost anyone can create a plan like that, the problem is, people aren't always willing to pay what you need to sell for, and often, competition arises that undercuts your asking price, or your employees aren't as productive as you hoped, or the economy turns down and your sales taper off, or some new government regulation raises the cost of doing business, or the cost of your raw materials goes up... in short, it takes lots more than just a good plan up front to create and maintain a successful business.


People pay for "value" and that can be reflective of cost, quality, functionality, or many other criteria. If everything came down to cost alone then Apple Computers would not exist because they cost far more than a Windows based computer. Every business needs to focus on "value to the customer" as opposed to cost although cost is a component of the value to the customer.

A business plan is not something that is "initial" but instead is a living and breathing part of the business. It accomodates changes in the economy to mitigate adverse effects. Anyone that creates a business plan and doesn't review it on a constant basis is probably doomed to failure.

We can also note that every enterprise needs to constantly be striving to improve the productivity of the employee. There are numerous ways to do this such as eliminating non-value-added work as well as increasing the employees knowledge through on the job training.

Perhaps, at least in my opinion, the greatest mistake by employers is to underpay their employees as that leads to high turn-over rates where experience and knowledge is lost. In the manufacturing industry, which is my expertise, it takes at least six months to bring an employee up to speed. That's six months of basically lost productivity for a new hire. Of course hiring people with experience cuts down on this but they also cost more and still require re-training related to the job.
  
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Jeff
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Re: Would you avoid Obamacare on principle?
Reply #16 - Mar 18th, 2014 at 4:22pm
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Shiva_TD wrote on Mar 18th, 2014 at 9:01am:
It's based upon the income tax laws under the 16th Amendment tht don't require apportionment and the case has already been heard by the US Supreme Court.

The issue was indeed addressed by the S.C., which held that the 16th Amendment did not create any new class of tax, and that the requirement for apportionment as to Direct taxes remained an effective part of our Constitution.
Read Brushaber v. Union Pacific R.R. Co. (I believe it's 240-U.S. 1)
  
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Re: Would you avoid Obamacare on principle?
Reply #17 - Mar 18th, 2014 at 4:27pm
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Shiva_TD wrote on Mar 18th, 2014 at 9:15am:




Perhaps, at least in my opinion, the greatest mistake by employers is to underpay their employees as that leads to high turn-over rates where experience and knowledge is lost. In the manufacturing industry, which is my expertise, it takes at least six months to bring an employee up to speed. That's six months of basically lost productivity for a new hire. Of course hiring people with experience cuts down on this but they also cost more and still require re-training related to the job.

Employers make lots of different mistakes, and are often unable to adapt rapidly, or at all, to changing economic conditions and government regulations beyond their control. That's why so many business fail, despite the best of plans.
There are very many jobs in manufacturing that require almost no training. If you actually had any expertise in manufacturing, which, based on your vacuous talk I doubt, you would know this.
  
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Shiva_TD
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Re: Would you avoid Obamacare on principle?
Reply #18 - Mar 19th, 2014 at 9:44am
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Jeff wrote on Mar 18th, 2014 at 4:27pm:
Employers make lots of different mistakes, and are often unable to adapt rapidly, or at all, to changing economic conditions and government regulations beyond their control. That's why so many business fail, despite the best of plans.


Most enterprises fail because the owners/managers are incompetent. Yes, economic changes like the 2008 recession caused many enterprises to fail and we can blame Congress and our government for the 2008 recession which failed to regulate the banking industry properly.

Rarely are enterprises forced out of business due to regulations with rare exceptions where the enterprise was simply out of control to begin with. I've been following the story on Duke Energy and can only hope that "regulations" drive it out of business. Even with a Republican legislature and a the Governor in NC (that worked for Duke for 28 years) trying to protect it by changing the laws it has still contaminated the environment so badly that people are now being told to not swim in or eat fish from the Dan River that it has polluted so badly that it's too dangerous for humans.

http://news.yahoo.com/federal-grand-jury-looks-duke-energy-spill-103345402.html
http://news.yahoo.com/tweak-nc-law-protected-dukes-180004852.html?vp=1

99% of all regulations are reasonable and we actually need more regulations to stop the abuses by enterprise. Yes, we need to get rid of the 1% of regulations that make no real sense but overwhelmingly regulations are warranted and we lack many regulations that should exist but don't. Few regulations impose a cost that enterprise shouldn't be paying for to begin with and those expenditures are generally small compared to the overall operating costs of the enterprise.

In 45 years of manufacturing I haven't seen even one regulation that wasn't warranted but have seen loopholes that shouldn't have been allowed created just to protect the enterprise from being held responsible for it's actions.

Jeff wrote on Mar 18th, 2014 at 4:27pm:
There are very many jobs in manufacturing that require almost no training. If you actually had any expertise in manufacturing, which, based on your vacuous talk I doubt, you would know this.


There used to be more of these "mindless" manufacturing jobs but most are done by robotics today. If it's that simple then a robot can do it better than a person and for much lower costs.
  
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Shiva_TD
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Re: Would you avoid Obamacare on principle?
Reply #19 - Mar 19th, 2014 at 10:07am
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Jeff wrote on Mar 18th, 2014 at 4:22pm:
The issue was indeed addressed by the S.C., which held that the 16th Amendment did not create any new class of tax, and that the requirement for apportionment as to Direct taxes remained an effective part of our Constitution.
Read Brushaber v. Union Pacific R.R. Co. (I believe it's 240-U.S. 1)


The tax (penalty) imposed under the PPACA is an income tax under the 16th Amendment.

Quote:
Starting in 2016, when the shared responsibility payment is fully in place, the amount you would owe for not having health insurance is the greater of 2.5 percent of your income or $695. There is currently no means to criminally prosecute those who do not have health insurance and also refuse to pay the shared responsibility payment.


http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/06/28/explaining-the-supreme-court-ru...

The tax (penalty) is exempt from apportionment under the 16th Amendment. We can also note that the claim that the government is going to come to the door armed and haul anyone's ass off to jail if they refuse to purchase insurance or pay the tax is false as there are no criminal statutes that would authorize it.
  
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