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Tom Palven
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Ron Paul on ISIS and Ukraine
Feb 17th, 2015 at 1:05am
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How Many More Wars?

By Ron Paul

Ron Paul Institute

February 17, 2015

Last week President Obama sent Congress legislation to authorize him to use force against ISIS “and associated persons and forces” anywhere in the world for the next three years. This is a blank check for the president to start as many new wars as he wishes, and it appears Congress will go along with this dangerous and costly scheme.

Already the military budget for next year is equal to all but the very peak spending levels during the Vietnam war and the Reagan military build-up, according to the Project on Defense Alternatives. Does anyone want to guess how much will be added to military spending as a result of this new war authorization?

The US has already spent nearly two billion dollars fighting ISIS since this summer, and there hasn’t been much to show for it. A new worldwide war on ISIS will likely just serve as a recruiting tool for jihadists. We learned last week that our bombing has led to 20,000 new foreign fighters signing up to join ISIS. How many more will decide to join each time a new US bomb falls on a village or a wedding party?

The media makes a big deal about the so-called limitations on the president’s ability to use combat troops in this legislation, but in reality there is nothing that would add specific limits. The prohibition on troops for “enduring” or “offensive” ground combat operations is vague enough to be meaningless. Who gets to determine what “enduring” means? And how difficult is it to claim that any ground operation is “defensive” by saying it is meant to “defend” the US? Even the three year limit is just propaganda: who believes a renewal would not be all but automatic if the president comes back to Congress with the US embroiled in numerous new wars?

If this new request is not bad enough, the president has announced that he would be sending 600 troops into Ukraine next month, supposedly to help train that country’s military. Just as the Europeans seem to have been able to negotiate a ceasefire between the opposing sides in that civil war, President Obama plans to pour gasoline on the fire by sending in the US military. The ceasefire agreement signed last week includes a demand that all foreign military forces leave Ukraine. I think that is a good idea and will go a long way to reduce the tensions. But why does Obama think that restriction does not apply to us?

Last week also saw the Senate confirm Ashton Carter as the new Secretary of Defense by an overwhelming majority. Carter comes to the Pentagon straight from the military industrial complex, and he has already announced his support for sending lethal weapons to Ukraine. Sen. John McCain’s strong praise for Carter is not a good sign that the new secretary will advise caution before undertaking new US interventions.

As we continue to teeter on the verge of economic catastrophe, Washington’s interventionists in both parties show no signs of slowing. The additional tens of billions or more that these new wars will cost will not only further undermine our economy, but will actually make us less safe. Can anyone point to a single success that the interventionists have had over the last 25 years?

As I have said, this militarism will end one way or the other. Either enough Americans will wake up and demand an end to Washington’s foreign adventurism, or we will go broke and be unable to spend another fiat dollar on maintaining the global US empire.

  
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The Opposition
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Re: Ron Paul on ISIS and Ukraine
Reply #1 - Feb 17th, 2015 at 1:15am
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Tom Palven wrote on Feb 17th, 2015 at 1:05am:
If this new request is not bad enough, the president has announced that he would be sending 600 troops into Ukraine next month, supposedly to help train that country’s military.


WHY?!

If we consider that all these wasted dollars could be used to buy and produce food, we could probably feed the world.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Tom Palven
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Re: Ron Paul on ISIS and Ukraine
Reply #2 - Feb 17th, 2015 at 5:30am
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The Opposition wrote on Feb 17th, 2015 at 1:15am:
WHY?!

If we consider that all these wasted dollars could be used to buy and produce food, we could probably feed the world.


Actually it's bloody typical, although we were taught differently in grammar school.

They didn't teach us that the ink was barely dry on the Constitution when US war hawks in the Senate fomented the invasion of Canada.
http://www.cryslersfarm.com/battle.htm

Then there was the invasion of Mexico, the Spanish-American War that Mark Twain railed against, and on and on.

Check out the description of Gore Vidal's book, Perpetual War for Perpetual Peace, at Amazon.
http://www.amazon.com/Perpetual-War-Peace-How-Hated/dp/156025405X

It's true as they taught us that America was the land of economic freedom and opportunity for many, but if the US government ever really stood for peace and justice abroad, someone would have to prove that to me.

Imho the US has never been a Sweden or a Switzerland, and it takes a lot of Orwellian doublethink, the ability to believe two contradictory things at the same time, to believe that it ever was.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublethink

Finally, check this out, from a US President and five-star general:
http://www.npr.org/2011/01/17/132942244/ikes-warning-of-military-expansion-50-ye...
  
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Jeff
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Re: Ron Paul on ISIS and Ukraine
Reply #3 - Feb 17th, 2015 at 8:46am
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The Opposition wrote on Feb 17th, 2015 at 1:15am:
WHY?!

If we consider that all these wasted dollars could be used to buy and produce food, we could probably feed the world.

No, the consideration is that productive people wouldn't be taxed to support a military that isn't actually defending the U.S, so those productive people would be allowed to use their money for whatever they chose. It's just a happy fact that people use their money more wisely than government uses their money, which produces prosperity instead of war.
  

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Land of Freedom
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Re: Ron Paul on ISIS and Ukraine
Reply #4 - Feb 17th, 2015 at 2:44pm
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What are libertarian solutions to deal with Islamic terrorism?

  

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Re: Ron Paul on ISIS and Ukraine
Reply #5 - Feb 17th, 2015 at 2:44pm
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One, private armies.
  

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Re: Ron Paul on ISIS and Ukraine
Reply #6 - Feb 17th, 2015 at 3:46pm
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Land of Freedom wrote on Feb 17th, 2015 at 2:44pm:
One, private armies.

Whose private army do you have in mind?

The sensible thing in my mind is to first consider where ISIS is, and where they are primarily operating. Then to look at all the countries around them who have considerable interest in not having ISIS grow any stronger or expand any further. Let them deal with them. If you need a list, look at a map.
  

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Re: Ron Paul on ISIS and Ukraine
Reply #7 - Feb 19th, 2015 at 4:21am
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The Opposition wrote on Feb 17th, 2015 at 1:15am:
WHY?!

If we consider that all these wasted dollars could be used to buy and produce food, we could probably feed the world.

Sometimes people need justice more than food.

Imagine if everybody gets the same money and profit don't go to those who produce it. Then no body will be productive and everybody will be starve.

Justice is more important than food.
  
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Tom Palven
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Re: Ron Paul on ISIS and Ukraine
Reply #8 - Mar 5th, 2015 at 3:38am
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The link below is the first mention of Mookie al-Sadr's Badr Brigade in a long time.

If true, to me it's disappointing because it implies that he has decided to throw in with Iran on a Shiite sectarian basis and will try to impose Shiite rule on all of Iraq again, which hasn't worked out very well since the US toppled Saddam Hussein's Sunni government.

It would probably mean that Mookie is not interested in the potentially larger Arab Spring movement that would include toppling the repressive regimes in Egypt and Saudi Arabia and opposing new Western puppet regimes in Yemen, Libya, etc.

I had hoped that he had a larger vision.

http://news.antiwar.com/2015/03/04/u...-iraqs-tikrit/
  
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Re: Ron Paul on ISIS and Ukraine
Reply #9 - Mar 5th, 2015 at 4:41pm
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Tom Palven wrote on Mar 5th, 2015 at 3:38am:
The link below is the first mention of Mookie al-Sadr's Badr Brigade in a long time.

If true, to me it's disappointing because it implies that he has decided to throw in with Iran on a Shiite sectarian basis and will try to impose Shiite rule on all of Iraq again, which hasn't worked out very well since the US toppled Saddam Hussein's Sunni government.

It would probably mean that Mookie is not interested in the potentially larger Arab Spring movement that would include toppling the repressive regimes in Egypt and Saudi Arabia and opposing new Western puppet regimes in Yemen, Libya, etc.

I had hoped that he had a larger vision.

http://news.antiwar.com/2015/03/04/u...-iraqs-tikrit/

You sound very involved in Muslim sectarian squabbles... I know you like the communist/Caliphate types, but I still say military dictators are the best, if you have to have authoritarian government at all that is.

My larger vision is to let countries in the path of, or occupied by ISIS get rid of ISIS or bow down before them, their choice. It would make sense to support anyone fighting for limited constitutional government and the protection of lives, liberty and property, but our current rulers prefer to support the Islamists, just like you do Tom.
  

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