Libertarian's Forum
Libertarian Forum to discuss politics and free market economics.
Libertarian's ForumLibertarian's ForumFreedom Forum › Do you support the Middle East policy?
Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 3 4 Send TopicPrint
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Do you support the Middle East policy? (Read 365 times)
kaz
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Small Government Libertarian

Posts: 1329
Location: Kazmania
Joined: Jun 6th, 2017
Do you support the Middle East policy?
Jun 19th, 2017 at 10:27am
Print Post  

As for me, no.  Not only should we stop engaging in the wars in the Middle East, but we should entirely leave.  We should let them know that if they stay out of our crap, we'll stay out of there.  They attack us, we'll send in jets and pay them back ten times over in description.  Let the Euro Weenies fight their own wars.

A few other notes:

1)  In Syria, we're actually fighting for ISIS.  How does that make sense?  We're not even on the right side, geez!  Toppling the Syrian government is one of the two stated objectives in the name of the organization. 

Anyone who understands the Middle East knows that Syria is a house divided because they have a Shiite government versus a Sunni populace. A Sunni government in Syria would make them united in evil.

2)  The British learned four times and the USSR once that you can't set up an Afghani government over the tribal society.  We will have to stay there permanently to try to make it happen

3)  Anyone who knows the history of Iraq knows it's a government fabricated by the British.  There is no historical reason for the format.  The country needs to split to have any chance.

4)  As for Saudi Arabia and other places, they teach their children in government schools that America is the great Satan.  And we keep them in power while they use oil against us.

The place is a shit hole.  Why are we there?  Let's focus on US energy independence, we're almost there.

And I call on Don particularly to oppose our terrible Middle East strategy for both parties, not just the Republicans.  Democrats aren't Gods, Don.  You had the right idea in opposing the US war machine, now follow it ...
  

Man does not control his own fate. The women in his life do that for him - Groucho Marx

A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way - Mark Twain
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Don_G
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Online

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 1403
Location: British Columbia
Joined: May 8th, 2017
Re: Do you support the Middle East policy?
Reply #1 - Jun 19th, 2017 at 12:51pm
Print Post  
kaz wrote on Jun 19th, 2017 at 10:27am:
As for me, no.  Not only should we stop engaging in the wars in the Middle East, but we should entirely leave.  We should let them know that if they stay out of our crap, we'll stay out of there.  They attack us, we'll send in jets and pay them back ten times over in description.  Let the Euro Weenies fight their own wars.

A few other notes:

1)  In Syria, we're actually fighting for ISIS.  How does that make sense?  We're not even on the right side, geez!  Toppling the Syrian government is one of the two stated objectives in the name of the organization. 

Anyone who understands the Middle East knows that Syria is a house divided because they have a Shiite government versus a Sunni populace. A Sunni government in Syria would make them united in evil.

2)  The British learned four times and the USSR once that you can't set up an Afghani government over the tribal society.  We will have to stay there permanently to try to make it happen

3)  Anyone who knows the history of Iraq knows it's a government fabricated by the British.  There is no historical reason for the format.  The country needs to split to have any chance.

4)  As for Saudi Arabia and other places, they teach their children in government schools that America is the great Satan.  And we keep them in power while they use oil against us.

The place is a shit hole.  Why are we there?  Let's focus on US energy independence, we're almost there.

And I call on Don particularly to oppose our terrible Middle East strategy for both parties, not just the Republicans.  Democrats aren't Gods, Don.  You had the right idea in opposing the US war machine, now follow it ...


Good thread and some good points! So first of all, to answer your points directed at me: Yes, I fullly condemn the US ME policy and everything to do with the US wars by both the D and the R party. Get out completely and stay out! Period!

Now, let's look at something you have mentioned in order to get started:

Quote:
As for me, no.  Not only should we stop engaging in the wars in the Middle East, but we should entirely leave.  We should let them know that if they stay out of our crap, we'll stay out of there.  They attack us, we'll send in jets and pay them back ten times over in description.


'They' aren't going to stop attacking your people and your country. It's too late for that because they are now seeking revenge. Can you at least handle hearing that 911 was a revenge attack on the US? It would be helpful to begin this discussion on thinking of ways those feelings could be defused by the US with a different attitude toward Muslims. And especially the attitude that is being promoted by Trump.

Let's all keep this thread civil and on topic. If not then it will just deteriorate into the waste of time like the others.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
kaz
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Small Government Libertarian

Posts: 1329
Location: Kazmania
Joined: Jun 6th, 2017
Re: Do you support the Middle East policy?
Reply #2 - Jun 19th, 2017 at 12:59pm
Print Post  
Don_G wrote on Jun 19th, 2017 at 12:51pm:
Good thread and some good points! So first of all, to answer your points directed at me: Yes, I fullly condemn the US ME policy and everything to do with the US wars by both the D and the R party. Get out completely and stay out! Period!


Yet in two other threads, you attacked Trump as if he began the policy when so far at least, he has ordered way fewer attacks than Obama did on a regular basis.  You want to pretend to be a Canadian, so when directly asked you say this.  But your arguments are all constructed on behalf of the Democrat party as if they are better.  They aren't.

Republicans and Democrats are Tweedledee and Tweedledum.  Republicans spend on the welfare state just like Democrats, Democrats use the military just like Republicans. 

Sure, they say different things, but they act the same.  That's why I stopped voting for them.  I left the Republican party circa 1990.  My standard to come back was I want one, legit reason.  I'm still waiting ...
  

Man does not control his own fate. The women in his life do that for him - Groucho Marx

A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way - Mark Twain
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Don_G
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Online

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 1403
Location: British Columbia
Joined: May 8th, 2017
Re: Do you support the Middle East policy?
Reply #3 - Jun 19th, 2017 at 1:25pm
Print Post  
kaz wrote on Jun 19th, 2017 at 12:59pm:
Yet in two other threads, you attacked Trump as if he began the policy when so far at least, he has ordered way fewer attacks than Obama did on a regular basis.  You want to pretend to be a Canadian, so when directly asked you say this.  But your arguments are all constructed on behalf of the Democrat party as if they are better.  They aren't.


I've given you everything you asked for on the US's ME policy. I don't agree that Trump has ordered far less attacks than Obama but that can be discussed too. I have no positive feelings for the Democrat party. I don't even think my politics are closer to theirs than to the R party. Left and right have practically no meaning anymore in the D and R parties.

Quote:
Republicans and Democrats are Tweedledee and Tweedledum.  Republicans spend on the welfare state just like Democrats, Democrats use the military just like Republicans.


Yes, and I have said that repeatedly on this board. 

Quote:
Sure, they say different things, but they act the same.  That's why I stopped voting for them.  I left the Republican party circa 1990.  My standard to come back was I want one, legit reason.  I'm still waiting ...


I hear you.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Don_G
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Online

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 1403
Location: British Columbia
Joined: May 8th, 2017
Re: Do you support the Middle East policy?
Reply #4 - Jun 19th, 2017 at 1:26pm
Print Post  
Now let's get back to addressing my post at 9:51, and how it answers to your concerns.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
kaz
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Small Government Libertarian

Posts: 1329
Location: Kazmania
Joined: Jun 6th, 2017
Re: Do you support the Middle East policy?
Reply #5 - Jun 19th, 2017 at 1:36pm
Print Post  
Don_G wrote on Jun 19th, 2017 at 1:25pm:
I've given you everything you asked for on the US's ME policy. I don't agree that Trump has ordered far less attacks than Obama but that can be discussed too. I have no positive feelings for the Democrat party. I don't even think my politics are closer to theirs than to the R party. Left and right have practically no meaning anymore in the D and R parties.


Yes, and I have said that repeatedly on this board. 


I hear you.


You don't, you bring it up in a partisan way.  And that you don't see Barrack Drone Attack Obama as having initiated the attacks Trump did just proves yet again what a Democrat mouthpiece you are
  

Man does not control his own fate. The women in his life do that for him - Groucho Marx

A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way - Mark Twain
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Don_G
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Online

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 1403
Location: British Columbia
Joined: May 8th, 2017
Re: Do you support the Middle East policy?
Reply #6 - Jun 19th, 2017 at 1:46pm
Print Post  
kaz wrote on Jun 19th, 2017 at 1:36pm:
You don't, you bring it up in a partisan way.  And that you don't see Barrack Drone Attack Obama as having initiated the attacks Trump did just proves yet again what a Democrat mouthpiece you are


I'm not sure what you mean by that but I do know that it's been reported that Trump has escalated the drone attacks. Do you have any other points you want to mention and debate?

If not then you may want to hear my views on how Iran is now out of bounds for a US led war?
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Don_G
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Online

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 1403
Location: British Columbia
Joined: May 8th, 2017
Re: Do you support the Middle East policy?
Reply #7 - Jun 19th, 2017 at 2:08pm
Print Post  
kaz wrote on Jun 19th, 2017 at 1:36pm:
You don't, you bring it up in a partisan way.  And that you don't see Barrack Drone Attack Obama as having initiated the attacks Trump did just proves yet again what a Democrat mouthpiece you are


Alright then kaz, it's time for me to tell you that you are in way over your head and are completely lost on US's ME wars. I've played along with you long enough now to see you are flondering with trying to find ways to disagree, trying to insult me when I'm being reasonable and polite, and asking questions of me so you can find the answers yourself.

What a complete fuc-ing waste of air you are.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
kaz
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Small Government Libertarian

Posts: 1329
Location: Kazmania
Joined: Jun 6th, 2017
Re: Do you support the Middle East policy?
Reply #8 - Jun 19th, 2017 at 2:18pm
Print Post  
Don_G wrote on Jun 19th, 2017 at 2:08pm:
Alright then kaz, it's time for me to tell you that you are in way over your head and are completely lost on US's ME wars. I've played along with you long enough now to see you are flondering with trying to find ways to disagree, trying to insult me when I'm being reasonable and polite, and asking questions of me so you can find the answers yourself.

What a complete fuc-ing waste of air you are.


Yes, my bad.  I don't realize like you that Democrats have already done the thinking for you and the best thing you can do is parrot them.  Keep in mind that American liberals are international leftists elitists like you and love it when you parrot them then say you don't like Democrats because they are Americans.  That isn't contradicting them, not at all
  

Man does not control his own fate. The women in his life do that for him - Groucho Marx

A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way - Mark Twain
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Don_G
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Online

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 1403
Location: British Columbia
Joined: May 8th, 2017
Re: Do you support the Middle East policy?
Reply #9 - Jun 19th, 2017 at 2:26pm
Print Post  
kaz wrote on Jun 19th, 2017 at 2:18pm:
Yes, my bad.  I don't realize like you that Democrats have already done the thinking for you and the best thing you can do is parrot them.  Keep in mind that American liberals are international leftists elitists like you and love it when you parrot them then say you don't like Democrats because they are Americans.  That isn't contradicting them, not at all


Yeah maybe! Grow up!
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 3 4
Send TopicPrint
 
Libertarian's ForumLibertarian's ForumFreedom Forum › Do you support the Middle East policy?
Libertarian's Forum

Libertarian's Forum Information Rules, Agreement and Privacy Policy