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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) What's the best strategy for libertarians to take to gain support? (Read 683 times)
Jeff
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Re: What's the best strategy for libertarians to take to gain support?
Reply #10 - Sep 19th, 2017 at 6:57pm
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Don_G wrote on Sep 18th, 2017 at 11:32am:
I think a libertarian has to start with a pure libertarian stance that honours all freedoms and start from there.

Then when rights and freedoms are considered more closely, some will obviously need to be curtailed due to conflicts of interest.
Eat shit and die bitch.
  
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Don_G
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Re: What's the best strategy for libertarians to take to gain support?
Reply #11 - Sep 19th, 2017 at 10:23pm
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Jeff wrote on Sep 19th, 2017 at 6:57pm:
Eat shit and die bitch.
Was it something I said?
  
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stevea
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Re: What's the best strategy for libertarians to take to gain support?
Reply #12 - Sep 20th, 2017 at 1:04am
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Don_G wrote on Sep 19th, 2017 at 10:23pm:
Was it something I said?


Just everything.

Who decides which freedoms are 'in conflict' ?  You and the mob of 51%, or does your powerful central state merely take or rgant freedom as it chooses ?

You've described nothing rational or workable, except in the sense that authoritarian states have a half-life ~1.5 generations.



  
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stevea
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Re: What's the best strategy for libertarians to take to gain support?
Reply #13 - Sep 20th, 2017 at 1:19am
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Don_G wrote on Sep 18th, 2017 at 3:36pm:
Own a gun? How big a gun? what kind of gun?

One that is full automatic and shoots guided missiles.

I have a right to live in relative safety from gun violence and allowing people to won shoulder fired rocket launchers is in violation of my rights.

Deal with it! I would suggest putting limits on guns for a start. Now you can start dealing with the limits to your rights in order to honour my rights.



So the idea is that you INVENT new rights as you choose, then want to use the state to restrict everyone else to your definitions.  That is REALLY silly.

There is no "right to relative safety", this is the imaging of a low-grade moron, deal with it.

I'd wager that most anyone in your neighborhood could kill you with a kitchen knife as you slept this evening.  Anyone with a car could run you down/dead  if/when you use public streets, walks & such.   If anyone had a mind to kill you - they could easily.  Your FEAR is likely unrealistic, but you want to use this irrational fear to rationalize control over others.

You seem to feel that a big huge paternalistic state will "protect" poor little you from your various fears, without realizing that the power to protect is the making of a prison, and the state isn't some font of morality & justice - often quite the opposite.
  
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Jeff
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Re: What's the best strategy for libertarians to take to gain support?
Reply #14 - Sep 20th, 2017 at 5:54pm
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Don_G wrote on Sep 18th, 2017 at 3:36pm:
Own a gun? How big a gun? what kind of gun?

Some people have old cannons and Gatling guns... They are very expensive to buy and shoot. Most places (reasonably) won't let you shoot them.

Even really cheap modern automatic weapons are fairly expensive because you have to buy a Class III License... But they are expensive to shoot too, and most places won't let you.

There is no problem with guns. Some people misuse them. Punish the people who misuse them.



  
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Don_G
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Re: What's the best strategy for libertarians to take to gain support?
Reply #15 - Sep 20th, 2017 at 5:59pm
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stevea wrote on Sep 20th, 2017 at 1:04am:
Just everything.

Who decides which freedoms are 'in conflict' ?  You and the mob of 51%, or does your powerful central state merely take or rgant freedom as it chooses ?

You've described nothing rational or workable, except in the sense that authoritarian states have a half-life ~1.5 generations.



The people will decide. The workers will decide. Libertarians could be a 1% part in the decision making but probably no more.

People like you make the libertarian brand more fringe than it already is. Is anybody going to join forces with a screaming maniac like you who acts like a child who has had his candy taken from him?
  
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Don_G
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Re: What's the best strategy for libertarians to take to gain support?
Reply #16 - Sep 20th, 2017 at 6:01pm
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Jeff wrote on Sep 20th, 2017 at 5:54pm:
Some people have old cannons and Gatling guns... They are very expensive to buy and shoot. Most places (reasonably) won't let you shoot them.

Even really cheap modern automatic weapons are fairly expensive because you have to buy a Class III License... But they are expensive to shoot too, and most places won't let you.

There is no problem with guns. Some people misuse them. Punish the people who misuse them.





Good answer Jeff if you could punish them by taking their guns from them before they go out and kill a bunch of school children!
  
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Jeff
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Re: What's the best strategy for libertarians to take to gain support?
Reply #17 - Sep 20th, 2017 at 6:10pm
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Don_G wrote on Sep 20th, 2017 at 6:01pm:
Good answer Jeff if you could punish them by taking their guns from them before they go out and kill a bunch of school children!
Sure, Right, that sounded good in ancient times, but now you have to take everybody's car away too, since cars have proved to be evil weapons of mass destruction. And knives.

I think more people are still killed with fists and ball bats and boots and such... Punish fist owners and boot wearers too! Be fair!
  
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Re: What's the best strategy for libertarians to take to gain support?
Reply #18 - Sep 21st, 2017 at 4:03pm
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SkyChief wrote on Sep 18th, 2017 at 11:43am:
Just have them take this simple quiz. It takes less than 2 minutes, and it demonstrates to many people that they are actually libertarian and didn't even know it!!

https://www.cato.org/libertarianmind/libertarian-quiz

Not a word in this "libertarian" definition about opposing US wars and foreign interventionism, or favoring the closing of the 900 or so US military bases located in 100 plus countries; or what the rights are of people living outside the US.

  
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Jeff
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Re: What's the best strategy for libertarians to take to gain support?
Reply #19 - Sep 21st, 2017 at 4:27pm
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Morris wrote on Sep 21st, 2017 at 4:03pm:
Not a word in this "libertarian" definition about opposing US wars and foreign interventionism, or favoring the closing of the 900 or so US military bases located in 100 plus countries; or what the rights are of people living outside the US.

You misunderstand. Classic liberals/libertarians share a common philosophy. We don't always agree on specific policies... (The disagreement is as to how it is best to obtain and secure Liberty.)

You were probably thinking of One Party States where everybody agrees at peril of their life.
  
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