Libertarian's Forum
Libertarian Forum to discuss politics and free market economics.
Libertarian's ForumLibertarian's ForumFreedom Forum › Does Thom have any point when he ties LP to Koch brothers
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 Send TopicPrint
Normal Topic Does Thom have any point when he ties LP to Koch brothers (Read 82 times)
DontTread44
Junior Member
**
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 38
Joined: Nov 22nd, 2016
Does Thom have any point when he ties LP to Koch brothers
Oct 10th, 2017 at 8:30am
Print Post  
Thom Hartmann, who absolutely loathes billionaires, continuously denounces the Libertarian Party as a "scam" created by billionaires to find useful idiots who will vouch for them.

He claims the Cato Institute is still owned by the Kochs, which it actually isn't. In fact they sued Cato in 2012 and separated from it.

However, the LP does admittedly have several ties to David Koch at least. He was of course the Party's vice-presidential nominee in 1980.

Personally I think this is a stupid analogy, because if the Party was truly a tool for billionaires, wouldn't billionaires have made the LP more successful than it actually is? Most people don't even know we exist.

Still, the Kochs are demonized like crazy and Democrats aren't wrong when they say the name now gives a negative vibe to it.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
ahhell
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 1217
Joined: Sep 21st, 2016
Re: Does Thom have any point when he ties LP to Koch brothers
Reply #1 - Oct 10th, 2017 at 9:28am
Print Post  
Then the GOP and Dems are the tools of millionaires?
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
burnsred
Libertarian Senior Member
****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 368
Joined: Sep 11th, 2017
Re: Does Thom have any point when he ties LP to Koch brothers
Reply #2 - Oct 10th, 2017 at 10:19am
Print Post  

Quote:
Personally I think this is a stupid analogy, because if the Party was truly a tool for billionaires, wouldn't billionaires have made the LP more successful than it actually is? Most people don't even know we exist.
My thoughts exactly.  If the Koch brothers are pumping money into the LP, what the heck are they doing with it?
Quote:
Then the GOP and Dems are the tools of millionaires?
More like the tools of billion dollar corporations, billion dollar unions and six-figure bureaucrats.

  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Crystallas
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 2101
Location: R[̲̅ə̲̅٨̲̅٥̲̅٦̲̅]ution
Joined: May 4th, 2011
Re: Does Thom have any point when he ties LP to Koch brothers
Reply #3 - Oct 10th, 2017 at 10:24am
Print Post  
Agreed. This is just pot calling the kettle black. Also, the Libertarian Party isn't the best representation of libertarianism either.  That's why most people make the distinction, small or big L.

RINOs, DINOs, LINOs.
Then you have people who call themselves conservative and liberal. Not a whole lot in the realm of professional politics is honest. What is bad, some people actually play by the dishonest terms. All of which takes a bad situation and makes it worse.

Partisanism has never helped anyone see clearly. The Kochs are rotten and Democrat talking heads will throw punches that way, but rarely attack their own crooks, like Soros, who is sponsoring a lot of domestic terrorism. Kochs are bad, but seriously, Soros is many levels worse. Shouldn't they be talking about him more? Ted Turner is influencing history, not with reason, but with his power in media. What about the Rockefellers? What about Bloomberg? Pritzker, the most guarded donor in the DNC?
I'd mention more republicans, but they ARE in the spotlight, like most of Trumps cabinet. Tillerson should be a bigger target than the Kochs as well. He has more wealth and corruption than them, despite net worth(doesn't factor liquidity in most indexes) being significantly lower. The man knows how to hide money better than anyone in politics.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Don_G
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 4254
Location: British Columbia
Joined: May 8th, 2017
Re: Does Thom have any point when he ties LP to Koch brothers
Reply #4 - Oct 10th, 2017 at 11:44am
Print Post  
Maybe we can work backward for a partial answer. There's little doubt that the libertarian party narrows itself down to support from the right. And then the champion of the Libertarian party, Ron Paul, was totally aligned with the right through his Republican party.

The pseudo-libertarian party that's being represented on this board has disqualified itself from being supported by half of Americans by leaning so far right.

It's too bad because so many ideals of the left are completely aligned with liberty, rights, and freedoms that are supposed to be their priorities.

This all leads to strengthen the suspicion that the libertarian party has been infiltrated by the rabid right Kochs.

The term 'socially responsible capitalism' has been put down viciously by the libertarians on this site ever since I brought it up. That can only be irrational and extremist rightist thinking to demonize those totally innocent words.

America needs new direction and for the libertarians to be able to play any part in the new politics, the country has to lose the paranioa for the left. Bernie was turned into the evil leftist enemy in part because of that paranoia.

Trump's apparent lean to the left in support of Russia was at least a beginning for his followers. Unfortunately there was nothing real about it in Trump. Positive things could have come out of it.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
SkyChief
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 4248
Joined: Aug 18th, 2014
Re: Does Thom have any point when he ties LP to Koch brothers
Reply #5 - Oct 10th, 2017 at 12:08pm
Print Post  
Don_G wrote on Oct 10th, 2017 at 11:44am:
America needs new direction and for the libertarians to be able to play any part in the new politics, the country has to lose the paranioa for the left. Bernie was turned into the evil leftist enemy in part because of that paranoia.

We are what we are.  You're trying to convince us that we need to be something else.  No wonder you've been sidelined so often on this forum.

Bernie is a socialist/statist --- the ideological opposite of libertarian.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Don_G
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 4254
Location: British Columbia
Joined: May 8th, 2017
Re: Does Thom have any point when he ties LP to Koch brothers
Reply #6 - Oct 10th, 2017 at 12:48pm
Print Post  
SkyChief wrote on Oct 10th, 2017 at 12:08pm:
We are what we are.  You're trying to convince us that we need to be something else.  No wonder you've been sidelined so often on this forum.


Chief, I haven't been sidelined. I know there's been a few attempts to do that but they have failed. And saying that could bring on another! I'm the center of attention on nearly all the topics because I'm the odd man out with my opinions. I don't mind doing that.

Quote:
Bernie is a socialist/statist --- the ideological opposite of libertarian.
[/quote]

Forget about Bernie. Your ideological positions have disqualified your Libertarian party from ever becoming mainstream. You could have at least tried to accept some middle of the road ideology that would have made libertarianism acceptable to a large number of people.

'Your' ideology is ridiculously fringe thinking and will never succeed. However, I do acknowledge that to you personally, success is not part of it. I'll continue to promote real libertarianism to the others who might be aware of something that differs from the two major parties becoming noticed.

Basically: Libertarianism that considers the rights and freedoms of millions of people, not just your select and dogmatic few. 
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
SkyChief
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 4248
Joined: Aug 18th, 2014
Re: Does Thom have any point when he ties LP to Koch brothers
Reply #7 - Oct 10th, 2017 at 10:45pm
Print Post  
Don_G wrote on Oct 10th, 2017 at 12:48pm:
Chief, I haven't been sidelined. I know there's been a few attempts to do that but they have failed. And saying that could bring on another! I'm the center of attention...


Delusional as usual.  *sigh*
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Don_G
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 4254
Location: British Columbia
Joined: May 8th, 2017
Re: Does Thom have any point when he ties LP to Koch brothers
Reply #8 - Oct 10th, 2017 at 11:35pm
Print Post  
SkyChief wrote on Oct 10th, 2017 at 10:45pm:
Delusional as usual.  *sigh*


You lad, have a hell of a lot of moxy to even suggest that after the raking over the coals I've given you about a half dozen times now!
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
DontTread44
Junior Member
**
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 38
Joined: Nov 22nd, 2016
Re: Does Thom have any point when he ties LP to Koch brothers
Reply #9 - Oct 11th, 2017 at 12:05am
Print Post  
Is it, or has it ever been, in the Party's platform to take money out of politics?

In Anatomy of the State, Rothbard says;

  Power must always be at war with the capitalist authorities and despoil the
  capitalists of their accumulated wealth; in doing so it obeys the laws of its nature.

Harry Browne also defends big businesses in The Great Libertarian Offer, arguing that government is actually the no. 1 polluter, and that businesses will maintain their land in order to maintain or increase property value for future sale of the property.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send TopicPrint
 
Libertarian's ForumLibertarian's ForumFreedom Forum › Does Thom have any point when he ties LP to Koch brothers
Libertarian's Forum

Libertarian's Forum Information Rules, Agreement and Privacy Policy