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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Is it Wrong to Call Sayfullo Saipov an Ingrate? (Read 154 times)
Don_G
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Re: Is it Wrong to Call Sayfullo Saipov an Ingrate?
Reply #10 - Nov 3rd, 2017 at 3:43pm
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burnsred wrote on Nov 3rd, 2017 at 2:51pm:
Now I know how honest you are.


Frankly burnsred, I don't want to invite anybody to live in my house with my family. But I don't make any distinction between 'anybody' and a rehabbed criminal. Living beside me as a neighbour would be just fine.

I don't know why you're having trouble understanding that. We've qualified the question and answer with the understanding that he would be rehabbed and had become a normal person who wouldn't believe in religious nonsense.

Now, if you want to change that and make it questionable whether or not he had been rehabbed then that's a different story.

You do what you like with your question.
  
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burnsred
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Re: Is it Wrong to Call Sayfullo Saipov an Ingrate?
Reply #11 - Nov 4th, 2017 at 11:42am
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I don't know why you're having trouble understanding that. We've qualified the question and answer with the understanding that he would be rehabbed and had become a normal person who wouldn't believe in religious nonsense.
Oh, OK.  That's your fallback position?

So you would indeed favor letting mass murderers out as soon as they are rehabbed and they can live right next to you and your family.  But the "rehab" you speak of doesn't exist and could not exist so it is only in theory that you would allow the "rehabbed" mass murderer to live next door but never, EVER in reality.

So your opinion is really no different from mine.  In the existing real world, neither of us wants Sayfullo Saipov to live next door or even to be released.

  
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Don_G
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Re: Is it Wrong to Call Sayfullo Saipov an Ingrate?
Reply #12 - Nov 4th, 2017 at 12:22pm
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burnsred wrote on Nov 4th, 2017 at 11:42am:
Oh, OK.  That's your fallback position?

So you would indeed favor letting mass murderers out as soon as they are rehabbed and they can live right next to you and your family.  But the "rehab" you speak of doesn't exist and could not exist so it is only in theory that you would allow the "rehabbed" mass murderer to live next door but never, EVER in reality.

So your opinion is really no different from mine.  In the existing real world, neither of us wants Sayfullo Saipov to live next door or even to be released.



My opinion is very different from yours. I favour rehailitiation and you favour long and lonber prison sentences.

the example you chose to use wasn't real but it could become real. I lean toward socially responsible government. You completely reject that so far. Are you trying to tell me you want to reconsider?

As to my answer, it's 100% honest and I believe the rehad in this imagined case could be possible.
  
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burnsred
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Re: Is it Wrong to Call Sayfullo Saipov an Ingrate?
Reply #13 - Nov 4th, 2017 at 12:26pm
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the example you chose to use wasn't real but it could become real.
Great news!  Tell us how.

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I lean toward socially responsible government. You completely reject that so far. Are you trying to tell me you want to reconsider?
The smaller the government is, the more socially responsible the government is.  Unless you define "society" as "government."

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As to my answer, it's 100% honest and I believe the rehad in this imagined case could be possible.
Awesome!  Tell us how.
  
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Don_G
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Re: Is it Wrong to Call Sayfullo Saipov an Ingrate?
Reply #14 - Nov 4th, 2017 at 12:36pm
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burnsred wrote on Nov 4th, 2017 at 12:26pm:
Great news!  Tell us how.

The smaller the government is, the more socially responsible the government is.  Unless you define "society" as "government."

Awesome!  Tell us how.


I've mentioned the case of Mahar Arar on another thread. You could continue the discussion on his case because it's real and he apparently killed an American soldier.

He's now living free in Canada and I believe has sued the government successfully for not attending to his case in an expedient manner.

We're ver different people burnsred and I'm using the opportunity to learn from you. I hope you are doing likewise. It brodens our horizons so to speak.
  
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burnsred
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Re: Is it Wrong to Call Sayfullo Saipov an Ingrate?
Reply #15 - Nov 4th, 2017 at 12:39pm
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What about Maher Arar?  A quick internet search indicates that he is guilty of nothing.  Is there more to it?
  
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Don_G
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Re: Is it Wrong to Call Sayfullo Saipov an Ingrate?
Reply #16 - Nov 4th, 2017 at 12:45pm
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burnsred wrote on Nov 4th, 2017 at 12:39pm:
What about Maher Arar?  A quick internet search indicates that he is guilty of nothing.  Is there more to it?



Lots more. There are rightists in Canada who still think he should be in jail, or executed if they could bring back the death penalty. He's as close to a perfect case of what you are trying to imagine, I can think of. Learn about the whole case if you want something real to pursue.
  
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burnsred
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Re: Is it Wrong to Call Sayfullo Saipov an Ingrate?
Reply #17 - Nov 5th, 2017 at 6:35pm
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What about Maher Arar?  A quick internet search indicates that he is guilty of nothing.  Is there more to it?



Lots more. There are rightists in Canada who still think he should be in jail, or executed if they could bring back the death penalty. He's as close to a perfect case of what you are trying to imagine, I can think of. Learn about the whole case if you want something real to pursue.
So your point is that Canadians are assholes?  Noted.

Sounds like Mr. Arar should emigrate to the U.S. like the rest of the huddled masses yearning to be free.
  
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Don_G
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Re: Is it Wrong to Call Sayfullo Saipov an Ingrate?
Reply #18 - Nov 5th, 2017 at 8:03pm
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burnsred wrote on Nov 5th, 2017 at 6:35pm:
So your point is that Canadians are assholes?  Noted.

Sounds like Mr. Arar should emigrate to the U.S. like the rest of the huddled masses yearning to be free.

You're being silly again.
  
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