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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Tax Advocates: Would You Personally Aim a Gun at Your Neighbor . . . (Read 372 times)
Don_G
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Re: Tax Advocates: Would You Personally Aim a Gun at Your Neighbor . . .
Reply #50 - Nov 13th, 2017 at 1:26pm
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burnsred wrote on Nov 13th, 2017 at 1:18pm:
Show me the research before you make that claim.

Nah, you made it too easy by not even trying.



You've claimed to support rehabilitation in prisons so are you going to continue to maintain you do? If so then I'm willing to get back into the discussion with you. But you're going to have to show some sincerity and stop making light of a serious topic.

I think my conditions are quite fair but if you don't then you are free to argue the issue on my conditions only. And you are totally free to disagree.
  
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Jeff
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Re: Tax Advocates: Would You Personally Aim a Gun at Your Neighbor . . .
Reply #51 - Nov 13th, 2017 at 2:44pm
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Don_G wrote on Nov 13th, 2017 at 1:26pm:
You've claimed to support rehabilitation in prisons so are you going to continue to maintain you do? If so then I'm willing to get back into the discussion with you. But you're going to have to show some sincerity and stop making light of a serious topic.

I think my conditions are quite fair but if you don't then you are free to argue the issue on my conditions only. And you are totally free to disagree.
Quite a while ago you were going to tell me how violent criminals were rehabilitated in Norway... What a surprise, you never have!
  
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Don_G
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Re: Tax Advocates: Would You Personally Aim a Gun at Your Neighbor . . .
Reply #52 - Nov 13th, 2017 at 3:27pm
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What else could there be to explain monkey boy? Do you want to be nice and learn something or are you just going to continue to play the asshole.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2013/feb/25/norwegian-prison-inmates-treated...

This is the picture of complete contentment and peace with the world.

Americans don't subscribe to any of these ideas so what's the point in trying to change their entire makeup and attitude of punitive punishment being the answer.

The plain fact of the matter is that the Norwegian ideas are working and they're working to a lesser degree in countries that don't subscribe completely. But nothing even close to the dismal failure of the US.

I mean monkey boy, what the fk else can be said?
  
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Jeff
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Re: Tax Advocates: Would You Personally Aim a Gun at Your Neighbor . . .
Reply #53 - Nov 13th, 2017 at 5:26pm
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Don_G wrote on Nov 13th, 2017 at 3:27pm:
What else could there be to explain monkey boy? Do you want to be nice and learn something or are you just going to continue to play the asshole.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2013/feb/25/norwegian-prison-inmates-treated...

This is the picture of complete contentment and peace with the world.

Americans don't subscribe to any of these ideas so what's the point in trying to change their entire makeup and attitude of punitive punishment being the answer.

The plain fact of the matter is that the Norwegian ideas are working and they're working to a lesser degree in countries that don't subscribe completely. But nothing even close to the dismal failure of the US.

I mean monkey boy, what the fk else can be said?
You have yet to say anything about how Norwegians rehabilitate violent criminals. You should start there.
  
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burnsred
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Re: Tax Advocates: Would You Personally Aim a Gun at Your Neighbor . . .
Reply #54 - Nov 13th, 2017 at 9:32pm
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Jeff wrote on Nov 13th, 2017 at 5:26pm:
You have yet to say anything about how Norwegians rehabilitate violent criminals. You should start there.


I think we're just supposed to say, "Norway?  Wow!  That Don_G is really smart.  I don't even speak no Norwaygen so I better just admit he's right so he don't know that."


  
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Don_G
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Re: Tax Advocates: Would You Personally Aim a Gun at Your Neighbor . . .
Reply #55 - Nov 14th, 2017 at 12:48pm
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Talking to Americans about reforming their prison system is as futile an effort as talking to them about how to stop the slaughter by gun. They're just not interested.

Maybe it's just enough to plant a bug in their brains by pointing out that it's their money in taxes that is being pissed away to uphold the failed system.

That's libertarian thinking to them!
  
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Jeff
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Re: Tax Advocates: Would You Personally Aim a Gun at Your Neighbor . . .
Reply #56 - Nov 14th, 2017 at 1:00pm
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Don_G wrote on Nov 14th, 2017 at 12:48pm:
Talking to Americans about reforming their prison system is as futile an effort as talking to them about how to stop the slaughter by gun. They're just not interested.

In general, libertarians are very interested i prison reform. Our first step is to stop jailing people for victimless crimes.

Almost all libertarians would love to know how Norway rehabilitates it's violent criminals... We don't care so much about turning prisons into full service luxury hotels for convicted thieves.
  
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thermf5
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Re: Tax Advocates: Would You Personally Aim a Gun at Your Neighbor . . .
Reply #57 - Nov 14th, 2017 at 1:06pm
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burnsred wrote on Nov 9th, 2017 at 9:42am:
. . . in order to force you neighbor to pay a tax as long as the money is intended for whatever good purpose the tax was levied for?

Assuming you were duly deputized by the government body who would benefit from that tax, would you be willing to hold a riot gun on Jim from next door if he refuses to pay the tax?  What if he still refuses?  Would you pull the trigger and move on the the next house to see if making an example out of Jim helped Josephine to see her civic duty? 

What if it were property tax and instead of being asked to shoot Jim, you were told to use your firepower to hold him off while county agents changed his locks and moved your friend's stuff onto the sidewalk?  If Jim makes a move to block the agents, would you let him have it with both barrels?   

Or do you prefer to have hired hands do the dirty work while you pat yourself on the back for being such a good citizen?

and that is y i could never work in law enforcement so thats a no
  
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Don_G
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Re: Tax Advocates: Would You Personally Aim a Gun at Your Neighbor . . .
Reply #58 - Nov 14th, 2017 at 1:11pm
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Jeff wrote on Nov 14th, 2017 at 1:00pm:
In general, libertarians are very interested i prison reform. Our first step is to stop jailing people for victimless crimes.

Almost all libertarians would love to know how Norway rehabilitates it's violent criminals... We don't care so much about turning prisons into full service luxury hotels for convicted thieves.


That's it! It's somewhere between full service luxury hotels and the status quo in the US. Maybe it's a steak for dinner once a week! How about a community swimming pool with lounge chairs?

How about all prisoners being given all those privileges and more. Not as a reward for good behaviour but just as a reward for being human. Then the prisoner who misbehaves, and there will be some, lose a privilege or two.

It's all about a socially acceptable way of treating people who have been incarcerated out of the perceived necessity. (a perception that needs adjustment in the US)

There is no downside to the method. It's all upside benefits and especially in the tax savings.

And there's just no downside in the risk of getting people out of jails too early. It's statistically proven. American citizens are being whacked or blown away in large numbres every day by reoffenders. It doesn't happen in Norway to anywhere the same degree.

Is anybody interested in saving your MONEY?

Quote:
But according to a report by the Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) about 68 percent of 405,000 prisoners released in 30 states in 2005 were arrested for a new crime within three years of their release from prison, and 77 percent were arrested within five years.


Link provided on request. (polite request!)

Quote:
Why Norway's prison system is so successful - Business Insider
www.businessinsider.com/why-norways-prison-system-is-so-successful-2014-12
Dec 11, 2014 - That makes Norway's incarceration rate just 75 per 100,000 people, compared to 707 people for every 100,000 people in the US. On top of that, when criminals in Norway leave prison, they stay out. It has one of the lowest recidivism rates in the world at 20%.

  
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Don_G
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Re: Tax Advocates: Would You Personally Aim a Gun at Your Neighbor . . .
Reply #59 - Nov 14th, 2017 at 1:20pm
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It's simply proven that Norway knows how to do it right and save their taxpayers money, money, money, kaching)

The rightist view that show no social responsibility toward prisoners simply doesn't work as well. The are going to have to bite the bullet and endure the pain of having to treat people like people.

It's as simple as: Joe Arpaio's way or Norway's way.

It doesn't hurt for Americans to know that, regardless of whether they can adjust to accepting the truth or not!

Enjoy!
  
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