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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Does Every Libertarian Agree that Discrimination Should Not be Banned? (Read 274 times)
burnsred
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Re: Does Every Libertarian Agree that Discrimination Should Not be Banned?
Reply #30 - Nov 14th, 2017 at 8:50pm
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Jeff wrote on Nov 14th, 2017 at 4:47pm:
You would allow governments to pass laws discriminating against people based on religion, political beliefs, skin color, sexual proclivities etc.?

I like our idea in America where governments are forbidden to pass such laws.
Actually, they are not.  Affirmative action is discrimination and Affirmative Action is the law.

As you may or may not realize, my question was about government restrictions on discrimination by individuals.  As a libertarian, do you support those restrictions on the behavior of individuals?

  
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The Opposition
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Re: Does Every Libertarian Agree that Discrimination Should Not be Banned?
Reply #31 - Nov 14th, 2017 at 10:51pm
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burnsred wrote on Nov 14th, 2017 at 8:50pm:
Actually, they are not.  Affirmative action is discrimination and Affirmative Action is the law.

As you may or may not realize, my question was about government restrictions on discrimination by individuals.  As a libertarian, do you support those restrictions on the behavior of individuals?


He won't answer. He'll just attack other peoples' answers.

I think it's an intriguing question because there seems to be a legitimate viewpoint that "in a libertarian world, discrimination would be allowed, but the result would be X, and this policy in our world brings a result of X, therefore this policy is more libertarian".

If so then anti-racists are justified in demanding perhaps even higher levels of things like affirmative action if they believe a libertarian world would, for example, see 78% of managerial positions go to nonwhites. If there's a good reason to think this, is an affirmative action justified that mandates at least 78% of managerial positions going to nonwhites?
  

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thermf5
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Re: Does Every Libertarian Agree that Discrimination Should Not be Banned?
Reply #32 - Nov 14th, 2017 at 11:21pm
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The Opposition wrote on Nov 14th, 2017 at 10:51pm:
He won't answer. He'll just attack other peoples' answers.

I think it's an intriguing question because there seems to be a legitimate viewpoint that "in a libertarian world, discrimination would be allowed, but the result would be X, and this policy in our world brings a result of X, therefore this policy is more libertarian".

If so then anti-racists are justified in demanding perhaps even higher levels of things like affirmative action if they believe a libertarian world would, for example, see 78% of managerial positions go to nonwhites. If there's a good reason to think this, is an affirmative action justified that mandates at least 78% of managerial positions going to nonwhites?

Affirmative Action is raciest just read the law also i discriminate agents people from collectivist coultres or people that bring god in to every thing antidiscramtion laws are not nessary any more but in the 60s to some time in the 90s it was necessary also lets bring up how black people could not get welfare or use the court system till the cival rights act was passed i just want every one to be juged on there skills not that thay where part of the greek lyf
  
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Jeff
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Re: Does Every Libertarian Agree that Discrimination Should Not be Banned?
Reply #33 - Nov 15th, 2017 at 9:34am
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burnsred wrote on Nov 14th, 2017 at 8:50pm:
Actually, they are not.  Affirmative action is discrimination and Affirmative Action is the law.

As you may or may not realize, my question was about government restrictions on discrimination by individuals.  As a libertarian, do you support those restrictions on the behavior of individuals?

The 14th Amendment prohibits states from discriminating. The national government is not granted any power to discriminate and is required to apply the law equally. It's a fundamental precept of our government.

To put it clearly, "affirmative action" is discrimination and the laws that provide for it are unconstitutional.

Freedom of conscience and freedom of association are Rights that the government may not infringe on or deny.
  
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Jeff
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Re: Does Every Libertarian Agree that Discrimination Should Not be Banned?
Reply #34 - Nov 15th, 2017 at 9:39am
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The Opposition wrote on Nov 14th, 2017 at 10:51pm:
I think it's an intriguing question because there seems to be a legitimate viewpoint that "in a libertarian world, discrimination would be allowed...

Preventing individuals from associating with (or not associating with) whoever they choose requires that government force associations the government has decided are "good" whether individuals like it or not. Not only does our government not have such power, the power itself denies individuals the liberty to order their own lives. It violates freedom of conscience and freedom of association and is in general an idea that is inimical to Liberty.
  
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burnsred
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Re: Does Every Libertarian Agree that Discrimination Should Not be Banned?
Reply #35 - Nov 15th, 2017 at 9:41am
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Jeff wrote on Nov 15th, 2017 at 9:39am:
Preventing individuals from associating with (or not associating with) whoever they choose requires that government force associations the government has decided are "good" whether individuals like it or not. Not only does our government not have such power, the power itself denies individuals the liberty to order their own lives. It violates freedom of conscience and freedom of association and is in general an idea that is inimical to Liberty.


Ok, so just to be clear because there are some slippery people on this board - when you say freedom of association, that includes hiring and firing, promoting, acceptance into non-government education programs or any other discrimination practiced by private individuals?


  
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Jeff
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Re: Does Every Libertarian Agree that Discrimination Should Not be Banned?
Reply #36 - Nov 15th, 2017 at 9:41am
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thermf5 wrote on Nov 14th, 2017 at 11:21pm:
Affirmative Action is raciest just read the law also i discriminate agents people from collectivist coultres or people that bring god in to every thing antidiscramtion laws are not nessary any more but in the 60s to some time in the 90s it was necessary also lets bring up how black people could not get welfare or use the court system till the cival rights act was passed i just want every one to be juged on there skills not that thay where part of the greek lyf
Yes, the intention of the Civil Rights laws was to enforce the 14th Amendment, which is a prohibition against states discriminating.
  
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Jeff
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Re: Does Every Libertarian Agree that Discrimination Should Not be Banned?
Reply #37 - Nov 15th, 2017 at 9:43am
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burnsred wrote on Nov 15th, 2017 at 9:41am:
Ok, so just to be clear because there are some slippery people on this board - when you say freedom of association, that includes hiring and firing, promoting, acceptance into non-government education programs or any other discrimination practiced by private individuals?


Joining clubs like 'People of Color Only' Fraternities too.
  
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Re: Does Every Libertarian Agree that Discrimination Should Not be Banned?
Reply #38 - Nov 15th, 2017 at 11:10am
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: Does Every Libertarian Agree that Discrimination Should Not be Banned?

No two libertarians will agree on much of anything in public. In private they seem to be pretty tight on discriminating against people who aren't white.
  
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Jeff
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Re: Does Every Libertarian Agree that Discrimination Should Not be Banned?
Reply #39 - Nov 15th, 2017 at 12:50pm
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Don_G wrote on Nov 15th, 2017 at 11:10am:
: Does Every Libertarian Agree that Discrimination Should Not be Banned?

Does every "progressive" agree that discrimination by the government is necessary and proper?
  
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