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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Global Warming (Read 1750 times)
Jeff
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Re: Global Warming
Reply #40 - Jan 11th, 2018 at 7:44am
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SnarkySack wrote on Jan 10th, 2018 at 7:57pm:
That's not my assertion.  That is the hypothetical situation presented by Oppo.




It's a quote of your words from reply #25.
  
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Jeff
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Re: Global Warming
Reply #41 - Jan 11th, 2018 at 7:49am
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ahhell wrote on Jan 10th, 2018 at 3:53pm:
It saddens me that Oppo and Don are correct on this.  Other libertarians refuse to admit this because there really doesn't seem to be a free market solution and it crashes against their ideology as a result.

Property rights enforced by the common law is the solution, but it would only work where property rights are respected and enforced, which means China and India and the rest of the third world will go on polluting like crazy... There doesn't seem to be a government "solution" for their polluting either...
  
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SnarkySack
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Re: Global Warming
Reply #42 - Jan 11th, 2018 at 9:11am
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Jeff wrote on Jan 11th, 2018 at 7:44am:
It's a quote of your words from reply #25.


Yes, which were based on the hypothetical situation presented by opposition.

Come on, Jeff you’re better than this. Aren’t you?
  

I used to be burnsred . . .
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Jeff
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Re: Global Warming
Reply #43 - Jan 11th, 2018 at 10:25am
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SnarkySack wrote on Jan 11th, 2018 at 9:11am:
Yes, which were based on the hypothetical situation presented by opposition.
It was you who made the unsupported assertion. What led you to make it is not important.
  
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Don_G
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Re: Global Warming
Reply #44 - Jan 11th, 2018 at 12:10pm
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ahhell wrote: Quote:
It saddens me that Oppo and Don are correct on this.  Other libertarians refuse to admit this because there really doesn't seem to be a free market solution and it crashes against their ideology as a result.


Can you expand on that? Can't the libertarian support climate change science because it crashes with their ideology. I'm truly confused by that idea.

I'm imagining it is very consistent with libertarianism.

Big business is embracing science's position on climate change throughout the world and profiting very well from doing it. The Scandinavian countries are far, far ahead on renewable clean energy sources. That's very libertarian in my opinion!

Anyway, what did you mean?
  
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SnarkySack
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Re: Global Warming
Reply #45 - Jan 11th, 2018 at 12:46pm
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Jeff wrote on Jan 11th, 2018 at 10:25am:
It was you who made the unsupported assertion. What led you to make it is not important.


So how do you think libertarianism would deal with a situation in which human activity was about to doom the human race to extinction?


  

I used to be burnsred . . .
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Don_G
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Re: Global Warming
Reply #46 - Jan 11th, 2018 at 12:53pm
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SnarkySack wrote on Jan 11th, 2018 at 12:46pm:
So how do you think libertarianism would deal with a situation in which human activity was about to doom the human race to extinction?




He's not the libertarian, you are now and you've proclaimed it to be.

But you're a libertariand who suggests that libertarians  would be left dumbfounded on how to save the human race from extinction.

Jeff owes you an answer on how a non-libertarian would do it but I wouldn't hold my breathe waiting.
  
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Don_G
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Re: Global Warming
Reply #47 - Jan 11th, 2018 at 12:55pm
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Climate change and guns. The same two are fighting it out in public and that's good.

Ahhell has opened a can of beans for them.
  
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SnarkySack
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Re: Global Warming
Reply #48 - Jan 11th, 2018 at 1:03pm
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The Opposition wrote on Jan 10th, 2018 at 11:24pm:
A legit answer, just let it happen. My answer was in no way, "just let it happen" anymore than not letting Charlie Manson work with lonely teenagers is "just let them kill themselves. 

But yes, it's a choice between this and sometimes government is necessary.


No, there are an almost infinite number of choices that are neither, "let the planet die off," nor "give more money and power to the government."

Jeff doesn't seem to realize that because he's much more constitutionalist than libertarian so he thinks government provides many wonderful benefits and would be awesome if it only stuck to the constitution. 

Quote:
Jeff doesn't want to choose because he's a &^%&ing perfection incarnate paladin. He'll never admit anything is wrong with anything except evil. He'll never admit that sometimes there's not an answer, and sometimes people are going to get screwed. It's not like this doesn't happen with other philosophies, but no, you see, libertarianism is PERFECT.


Yes, the overwhelming majority of criticisms of libertarianism rely on comparing it to a non-existent perfectly and fairly executed authoritarian government.

Quote:
I sometimes feel like some people are overcompensating for the fact that their philosophy doesn't work. I actually think libertarianism probably works at least as well as competing philosophies, but talking to some (not you Burnsy) it seems like the adherents of libertarianism don't actually think that. They think they're deceiving everyone else because the philosophy brings THEM advantage and hurts everyone else.


Yes, this is something I have to keep explaining the libertarians on here.  Not to pick on Jeff, but he thinks he should have the right to bear arms (as long as he approves the purpose) but if there is a guy wearing a suspicious looking hoodie in his neighborhood, he wants to be able to call his pal the Sheriff and have the guy braced, patted down and have is ID run for warrants.

Libertarian isn't easy.  Everyone will give up something if we ever have a libertarian system. 


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What there's not terribly much evidence for is manmade, catastrophic global warming.

There is evidence for about half a degree of manmade global warming over the last few decades. My opinion is that if this does anything, it will bring plagues of insects. Some insects in some places only need half a degree more to burst out of their life cycle and breed year round. As devastating as this might be locally, even this is not "catastrophic" on the level most environmentalists fear. But you don't hear about the bugs because it's not political. You can't charge people or tax people because bugs.

Neither side has an answer for this. The leftists won't solve it because they have no more interest in solving it then they do legalising drugs. They need to preserve the problem so they can win votes. If they actually solve problems, their voter base disappears.


If there is such a thing as AGW, it is incredibly slow and often pauses.  So we will have plenty of time to adjust with no central planning needed.  Even if that were not true, when there is a critical problem that needs to be solved with speed and precision, government is not the go-to.


  

I used to be burnsred . . .
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Don_G
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Re: Global Warming
Reply #49 - Jan 11th, 2018 at 1:24pm
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On AGW, listen to ahhell.

On guns, listen to nobody, everything is just fine and getting better from the rest of the world's POV.
  
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