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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Government interference in the free market making things worse? (Read 259 times)
DontTread44
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Government interference in the free market making things worse?
Feb 2nd, 2018 at 4:52pm
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What are some examples of this?
  
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Jeff
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Re: Government interference in the free market making things worse?
Reply #1 - Feb 2nd, 2018 at 5:01pm
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DontTread44 wrote on Feb 2nd, 2018 at 4:52pm:
What are some examples of this?
Duh, how would we know... Isn't government regulation required to make things fair?

For lots of people, government regulation of the economy butters their bread. They think more butter is better, on better bread please.

Since this is a libertarian forum, allow me to ask the question properly from our perspective-

Government interference in the free market making things better?
  
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kaz
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Re: Government interference in the free market making things worse?
Reply #2 - Feb 2nd, 2018 at 5:14pm
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DontTread44 wrote on Feb 2nd, 2018 at 4:52pm:
What are some examples of this?


regulations and taxes are driving businesses to offshore as much work as they can.

The minimum wage gets low end workers fired.

Unemployment tax rules prevent businesses from giving dubious workers a chance and firing them quickly if they do

OSHA causes businesses to shut down over ridiculous standards

The NLRB drives massive offshoring

Foreign autos are built in the US and US cars are built in foreign countries (e.g., Mexico) because of our idiotic union policies where the Federal government gives the power to unions who don't have the market power

Just a few
  

Greg Gutfeld - I became a conservative by being around liberals and I became a libertarian by being around conservatives

Matt Stone - I hate conservatives, but I really f'ing hate liberals
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Don_G
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Re: Government interference in the free market making things worse?
Reply #3 - Feb 4th, 2018 at 3:06pm
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kaz wrote on Feb 2nd, 2018 at 5:14pm:
regulations and taxes are driving businesses to offshore as much work as they can.

The minimum wage gets low end workers fired.

Unemployment tax rules prevent businesses from giving dubious workers a chance and firing them quickly if they do

OSHA causes businesses to shut down over ridiculous standards

The NLRB drives massive offshoring

Foreign autos are built in the US and US cars are built in foreign countries (e.g., Mexico) because of our idiotic union policies where the Federal government gives the power to unions who don't have the market power

Just a few


Even though you are wrong, you make a point with each of those examples. They're all related to efforts to give the middle class a leg up and all the indicate how irresponsible big business resorts to dirty tricks to neutralize any positive effect.

In the US there is no attempt to find any common ground where everybody's boat can be raised together. And the result is completely and utterly destructive.

Trump has come up with some ideas of how to accelerate the whole process and make it a lot worse in a short period of time.

And all you wankers support Trump because you're really all still Republicans.

The amusing thing about this is that Jeff understands that and says so every day but sometimes in language a lot of you can't understand.
  
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kaz
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Re: Government interference in the free market making things worse?
Reply #4 - Feb 4th, 2018 at 3:45pm
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Don_G wrote on Feb 4th, 2018 at 3:06pm:
Even though you are wrong, you make a point with each of those examples. They're all related to efforts to give the middle class a leg up and all the indicate how irresponsible big business resorts to dirty tricks to neutralize any positive effect.

In the US there is no attempt to find any common ground where everybody's boat can be raised together. And the result is completely and utterly destructive.

Trump has come up with some ideas of how to accelerate the whole process and make it a lot worse in a short period of time.

And all you wankers support Trump because you're really all still Republicans.

The amusing thing about this is that Jeff understands that and says so every day but sometimes in language a lot of you can't understand.


You don't make people more successful in life by giving them a handout, which you euphemistically call a "leg up."

People can only make themselves more successful.

Government's job is to stay out of the way, not get in the way of that
  

Greg Gutfeld - I became a conservative by being around liberals and I became a libertarian by being around conservatives

Matt Stone - I hate conservatives, but I really f'ing hate liberals
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Jeff
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Re: Government interference in the free market making things worse?
Reply #5 - Feb 4th, 2018 at 6:01pm
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kaz wrote on Feb 4th, 2018 at 3:45pm:
You don't make people more successful in life by giving them a handout, which you euphemistically call a "leg up."

People can only make themselves more successful.

Government's job is to stay out of the way, not get in the way of that
I agree, but the government is supposed to help out, not just stay out of the way.
It's hard to be successful without an impartial system to help protect your life, Liberty and property. If the government steals what you can produce and leaves you vulnerable so thieves can steal the rest, you don't have an opportunity to be successful.

Their is a direct correlation between bad government and lack of opportunities.
  
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Don_G
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Re: Government interference in the free market making things worse?
Reply #6 - Feb 4th, 2018 at 7:03pm
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Jeff wrote on Feb 4th, 2018 at 6:01pm:
I agree, but the government is supposed to help out, not just stay out of the way.
It's hard to be successful without an impartial system to help protect your life, Liberty and property. If the government steals what you can produce and leaves you vulnerable so thieves can steal the rest, you don't have an opportunity to be successful.

Their is a direct correlation between bad government and lack of opportunities.


Libertarians have been snookered into believing the handouts go to the people. In fact the handouts go to the 1% or 2% who get to use the resources of your country for free.

You actually know that because you've stated it in you confusing way.

You've also made the pig the enemy and that's a good thing. Can you ask him to take another year off?
  
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kaz
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Re: Government interference in the free market making things worse?
Reply #7 - Feb 5th, 2018 at 11:00am
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Jeff wrote on Feb 4th, 2018 at 6:01pm:
I agree, but the government is supposed to help out, not just stay out of the way.
It's hard to be successful without an impartial system to help protect your life, Liberty and property. If the government steals what you can produce and leaves you vulnerable so thieves can steal the rest, you don't have an opportunity to be successful.

Their is a direct correlation between bad government and lack of opportunities.


Conflating government protecting your rights (police, courts, ...)  and government violating your rights (redistribution of wealth, ...) is a stupid argument, Jeff.  It's hilarious with the ODD how you can't just agree with a post you agree with.

No libertarian would call the police coming to your house which was broken into government "helping" you.

Jeff's Boondocks police department motto.  We're there to help!  Sure Jeff
  

Greg Gutfeld - I became a conservative by being around liberals and I became a libertarian by being around conservatives

Matt Stone - I hate conservatives, but I really f'ing hate liberals
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Jeff
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Re: Government interference in the free market making things worse?
Reply #8 - Feb 5th, 2018 at 1:52pm
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kaz wrote on Feb 5th, 2018 at 11:00am:
Conflating government protecting your rights (police, courts, ...)  and government violating your rights (redistribution of wealth, ...) is a stupid argument, Jeff. 

No libertarian would call the police coming to your house which was broken into government "helping" you.

How about if you violated a contract between us, and I took you to court? That could be helpful to me.

Lucky me I never argued that wealth re-distribution was helpful to anyone except the people doing the distributing.
  
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ahhell
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Re: Government interference in the free market making things worse?
Reply #9 - Feb 5th, 2018 at 2:00pm
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DontTread44 wrote on Feb 2nd, 2018 at 4:52pm:
What are some examples of this?

Rent control is a classic.  As it always reduces available housing and causes shortages.  Fixes like allowing market rates when someone leaves an apartment voluntarily results in dramatically increased prices for the reduced housing stock.

Farm subsidies in the US result in overproduction so food is cheap which is the desired effect.  On the other hand we have an obesity epidemic and fairly destructive farming practices.

Tariffs on sugar result in US consumers paying twice as much as everyone else and using high fructose cornsyrup instead, see above.

Tariffs on tires under obama raised the price on tires and cost the economy more than the value of jobs saved.

Steel tariffs under Bush II, same as above almost certainly contributed to the recession.

Wait and see what happens as a result of trump's tariffs.

Government subsidies home loans contributed to and probably caused the housing bubble and following recession.
  
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