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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) If Teachers are Armed, Police will Shoot Them instead of Attackers (Read 397 times)
Jeff
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Re: If Teachers are Armed, Police will Shoot Them instead of Attackers
Reply #30 - Mar 4th, 2018 at 2:18pm
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Sicklers Dink wrote on Mar 4th, 2018 at 1:02pm:
And that explains a lot of the problem doesn't it!
"Gun free zones" explain most of the problem, the rest lies with "progressive" child rearing and drugging school students with mind altering drugs.
  
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Sicklers Dink
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Re: If Teachers are Armed, Police will Shoot Them instead of Attackers
Reply #31 - Mar 4th, 2018 at 3:05pm
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Jeff wrote on Mar 4th, 2018 at 2:17pm:
You're impressed with the training and professionalism of School Safety Officers?

I know quite a few people with concealed carry permits. They practice with their weapons more often than many police officers, some of whom only shoot once a year when they have to qualify, and all of the concealed carriers I know are responsible and careful.

As usual, you conjure up a tragedy when you don't know what you're talking about.

He's being sensible and he knows what he's talking about. You're just a biased gungoon idiot.

Put ten random cops up against ten random gungoons and the cops will probalby get all ten before the gungoons get a cop.

Really stupid jeff. Exceptions are not the rule so don't go off frantically looking for them to try to prove a point with burnsred.
  
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SnarkySack
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Re: If Teachers are Armed, Police will Shoot Them instead of Attackers
Reply #32 - Mar 4th, 2018 at 3:13pm
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Jeff wrote on Mar 4th, 2018 at 2:17pm:
You're impressed with the training and professionalism of School Safety Officers?

I know quite a few people with concealed carry permits. They practice with their weapons more often than many police officers, some of whom only shoot once a year when they have to qualify, and all of the concealed carriers I know are responsible and careful.

As usual, you conjure up a tragedy when you don't know what you're talking about.


Yes, as with most things, free civilians are more effective than government officials.  Unfortunately, public school teachers are also government officials and their campus and district administrators answer to the elected politicians of the school boards.  They are sure to set rules for armed teachers that will render them completely ineffective thus the added hazard of more firearms will do nothing to increase safety.

No weapon that can be carried concealed is likely to be effective against an AR or an AK.  A better idea would be to arm school police with M16's or other high firepower weapons.  But a better way to "harden" schools against intruders is to do what we do at airports and federal buildings.  Guarded entrances, metal detectors, x-rays and searches to make sure guns aren't brought into the schools.  If we secure middle-aged bureaucrats that way, why not our school kids?

Gun free zones would actually be effective if they were enforced though those methods.  Just putting up a sign with cute kid's hand prints saying "No Guns Aloud" obviously is a waste of time. 

I have a concealed carry permit and I shoot often for practice.  But I wouldn't want to bring my little snubbie .38 to a school because it would be far more likely to hurt a child than stop an intruder.  When you say that government school teachers should carry firearms, you're not advocating for freedom any more than when people say, "oh yeah.  The EPA definitely needs a SWAT team."

Look to the root cause of shootings in government schools:  A high pressure system and strong recommendations to drug up students who don't function well in that kind of pressure.
   
  

I used to be burnsred . . .
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Jeff
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Re: If Teachers are Armed, Police will Shoot Them instead of Attackers
Reply #33 - Mar 4th, 2018 at 5:11pm
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SnarkySack wrote on Mar 4th, 2018 at 3:13pm:
Look to the root cause of shootings in government schools:  A high pressure system...
Let's talk about this.

They way I understand it, if you are still breathing in a "progressive" inner city "school" after 12-15 years of "schooling", they will give you a diploma just for not dropping out, whether you can read and do arithmetic or not.

Where's the pressure?

From dropout drug gang "peers" who might beat you or kill you for selling out to the "system".
  
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SnarkySack
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Re: If Teachers are Armed, Police will Shoot Them instead of Attackers
Reply #34 - Mar 4th, 2018 at 8:19pm
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Jeff wrote on Mar 4th, 2018 at 5:11pm:
Let's talk about this.

They way I understand it, if you are still breathing in a "progressive" inner city "school" after 12-15 years of "schooling", they will give you a diploma just for not dropping out, whether you can read and do arithmetic or not.

Where's the pressure?

From dropout drug gang "peers" who might beat you or kill you for selling out to the "system".


That's probably still true of inner-city schools.  Especially the pressure on young African-American males to not "act white" by being successful academically.  That is probably the greatest contributor to the stat that college age black men are more likely to go to prison than to college.  Ironically, those young men often profess a love for Obama who was able to "act white" so effectively that he actually made it to the White House.

As far as I know, the overwhelming majority of school shootings take place in predominantly white schools and are done by kids who have been prescribed mood altering drugs.  Those are the misfits who are under severe pressure to "be normal" by passing standardized tests.  Standardized tests have become almost the entire focus of education in the public schools.  All adult staff, including counselors and PE coaches are expected to contribute to the effort to become a "commended campus" or whatever name is given for success on high stakes testing.  Not only funding, but also property values of a neighborhood can be affected by student performances on these ridiculous tests. 

The tests are ridiculous because they tend to measure cognitive ability rather than teacher effectiveness as they are advertised to do.  They are highly g-loaded and require fluid reasoning and problem solving skills rather than prior learning. Students who are unable to perform academically have no safety valve as school have reduced classes such as shop and remedial math in favor of spending the resources on test prep.

In the days in which public schools were very much local, there was an out.  If a kid wasn't suited to sit in a chair learning math and literature, he could work the farm, wrangle cattle, become a blacksmith or later work in a factory.  Somehow we convinced ourselves that any American can and should go to college and those opportunities were given to immigrants. 
  

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Jeff
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Re: If Teachers are Armed, Police will Shoot Them instead of Attackers
Reply #35 - Mar 5th, 2018 at 6:22am
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SnarkySack wrote on Mar 4th, 2018 at 8:19pm:
Somehow we convinced ourselves that any American can and should go to college and those opportunities were given to immigrants. 
A good post except for this last comment, which I don't understand. Are you saying immigrants get bonus points so they can get into college easier?
  
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SnarkySack
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Re: If Teachers are Armed, Police will Shoot Them instead of Attackers
Reply #36 - Mar 5th, 2018 at 9:22am
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Jeff wrote on Mar 5th, 2018 at 6:22am:
A good post except for this last comment, which I don't understand. Are you saying immigrants get bonus points so they can get into college easier?


No, sorry if that was unclear.   "Those opportunities" refers to farm work, ranch work, construction work, etc. that young people who did not adapt well to primary and secondary education used to be able to go into instead.

Now we force American kids to stay  in school whether it does them any good or not and rely on illegal immigrants or guest workers to to the hard labor.

  

I used to be burnsred . . .
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Sicklers Dink
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Re: If Teachers are Armed, Police will Shoot Them instead of Attackers
Reply #37 - Mar 5th, 2018 at 12:26pm
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SnarkySack wrote on Mar 5th, 2018 at 9:22am:
Now we force American kids to stay  in school whether it does them any good or not and rely on illegal immigrants or guest workers to to the hard labor.



It's usually the side issues where you say the most important things. It's no longer a secret why the illegal immigrant problem is not really a problem.

Trump's lack of understanding when he was making his campaign promises to the lowbrows is slowly being corrected.

DACA is such a hard blow for those lowbrows to accept, even though both major parties are for getting it done.
  
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Jeff
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Re: If Teachers are Armed, Police will Shoot Them instead of Attackers
Reply #38 - Mar 5th, 2018 at 5:57pm
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SnarkySack wrote on Mar 5th, 2018 at 9:22am:
No, sorry if that was unclear.   "Those opportunities" refers to farm work, ranch work, construction work, etc. that young people who did not adapt well to primary and secondary education used to be able to go into instead.


They still could, except that our current crop of young people seem incapable of competing with immigrants no matter where the immigrants come from.

Maybe if our young people tried working, it would help? Nothing like a couple of summers of farm or construction work to make you want to learn some skills... And maybe you could become a skilled construction worker or farm employee... But how would you know if you never work? If you sit in the house and let your parents pay Mexicans to mow your lawn, don't blame "capitalism".
  
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Re: If Teachers are Armed, Police will Shoot Them instead of Attackers
Reply #39 - Mar 5th, 2018 at 6:29pm
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Jeff wrote on Mar 5th, 2018 at 5:57pm:
They still could, except that our current crop of young people seem incapable of competing with immigrants no matter where the immigrants come from.

Maybe if our young people tried working, it would help? Nothing like a couple of summers of farm or construction work to make you want to learn some skills... And maybe you could become a skilled construction worker or farm employee... But how would you know if you never work? If you sit in the house and let your parents pay Mexicans to mow your lawn, don't blame "capitalism".


Quite right.  It's hard to pick cotton and check snapchat every five minutes.

Still I know some kids that literally refuse to read and right no matter how many detentions or even suspensions they get.  But when one of them gets home he not only mows lawns for money, he does it with a lawnmower that he assembled from three broken down lawnmowers people gave him.  Ok, that's only one kid.  Get other of them off the video games or better yet, make them work for the money to buy them and they'll learn responsibility even if they don't ever learn to analyze poetry as our standardized testing requires.
  

I used to be burnsred . . .
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