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SnarkySack
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I Thought, 'Crap! A 25% Tarrif on Imported Steel?'
Mar 6th, 2018 at 12:11pm
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Of course I heard the figure on NPR, which specializes in bashing Trump.  That really sets it apart from the non-government media, right?

My first reaction was that 254% seems shockingly high.  Then I remembered that the same pro-big government commentators on NPR think it's just fine to take 25% of the earnings of a public school teacher  or a waitress or a mechanic so why shouldn't a giant Chinese state-supported steel company pay the same?  Especially since they enjoy the protection of the U.S. Navy when shipping across the Pacific . . .



  

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Re: I Thought, 'Crap! A 25% Tarrif on Imported Steel?'
Reply #1 - Mar 6th, 2018 at 12:24pm
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SnarkySack wrote on Mar 6th, 2018 at 12:11pm:
My first reaction was that 254% seems shockingly high. 

WOW!! that IS shockingly high!    Shocked      

Grin   Grin   Wink
  
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Sicklers Dink
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Re: I Thought, 'Crap! A 25% Tarrif on Imported Steel?'
Reply #2 - Mar 6th, 2018 at 1:31pm
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SnarkySack wrote on Mar 6th, 2018 at 12:11pm:
Of course I heard the figure on NPR, which specializes in bashing Trump.  That really sets it apart from the non-government media, right?

My first reaction was that 254% seems shockingly high.  Then I remembered that the same pro-big government commentators on NPR think it's just fine to take 25% of the earnings of a public school teacher  or a waitress or a mechanic so why shouldn't a giant Chinese state-supported steel company pay the same?  Especially since they enjoy the protection of the U.S. Navy when shipping across the Pacific . . .





Do you think Trump can get away with it? My guess on it working with China would be biased so I won't.

With Canada, it's also going to be biased so I don't have to guess for you.

I actually welcome it because it's time Canadian industry bit the bullet and took the hit. It can result in trade diversification away from the US. It's not Canada's choice but it seems that there's nothing we can do about it. Doing something about it is up to the US.

The main point is, China and Canada can take the hit. The rest of the world can take the hit and that makes Trump pretty well isolated in his ignorance.

I think it's bigger than taking on Canada or something to do with steel. It's taking on China before it's too late.

Is it too late?

What do you think of the Chief's valued and informed opinion?
Grin x3?
  
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Re: I Thought, 'Crap! A 25% Tarrif on Imported Steel?'
Reply #3 - Mar 6th, 2018 at 2:30pm
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SnarkySack wrote on Mar 6th, 2018 at 12:11pm:
Of course I heard the figure on NPR, which specializes in bashing Trump.  That really sets it apart from the non-government media, right?

My first reaction was that 254% seems shockingly high.
Our government did the same thing once before to "protect" the 'legacy' giant steel companies in the U.S.

It hurt everybody and the big steel companies still went out of business. (Japanese car companies ended up being the big winners.)

If this tariff is applied it will hurt every industry in America that uses steel and every American who buys products with steel in them.
  
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Re: I Thought, 'Crap! A 25% Tarrif on Imported Steel?'
Reply #4 - Mar 6th, 2018 at 4:01pm
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SnarkySack wrote on Mar 6th, 2018 at 12:11pm:
My first reaction was that 25% seems shockingly high.  Then I remembered that the same pro-big government commentators on NPR think it's just fine to take 25% of the earnings of a public school teacher  or a waitress or a mechanic so why shouldn't a giant Chinese state-supported steel company pay the same?


Because it's wrong. Two wrongs don't make a right.
  

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Re: I Thought, 'Crap! A 25% Tarrif on Imported Steel?'
Reply #5 - Mar 6th, 2018 at 6:23pm
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The Opposition wrote on Mar 6th, 2018 at 4:01pm:
Because it's wrong. Two wrongs don't make a right.
Who are you agreeing to agree with now?
  
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SnarkySack
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Re: I Thought, 'Crap! A 25% Tarrif on Imported Steel?'
Reply #6 - Mar 6th, 2018 at 9:17pm
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Sicklers Dink wrote on Mar 6th, 2018 at 1:31pm:
Do you think Trump can get away with it? My guess on it working with China would be biased so I won't.

With Canada, it's also going to be biased so I don't have to guess for you.

I actually welcome it because it's time Canadian industry bit the bullet and took the hit. It can result in trade diversification away from the US. It's not Canada's choice but it seems that there's nothing we can do about it. Doing something about it is up to the US.

The main point is, China and Canada can take the hit. The rest of the world can take the hit and that makes Trump pretty well isolated in his ignorance.

I think it's bigger than taking on Canada or something to do with steel. It's taking on China before it's too late.

Is it too late?

What do you think of the Chief's valued and informed opinion?
Grin x3?


It's way to early to tell what the eventual outcome will be.  I don't know why people don't learn that whatever Trump is saying at any given moment is not his dogma that he'll stick with, it's a negotiating position. 

China is not going to want to stop selling steel to the U.S. and of course they don't want to give the U.S. government twenty-five percent of the selling price when they do sell it.  So they'll make an offer.  Probably lowering tariffs on U.S. exports to China or some otehr benefit to the U.S.  Trump will make a counter offer and both sides will bluster and claim outrage.  Except the Chinese won't have to bluster and feign outrage too much because they have CNN and FOX to do that for them.  Eventually Trump and the Chinese will come to an agreement.

That's how the leaders of every other country except the United States deal with each other.  American statists are shocked because they are used to president who give away the store for the sake of the "accomplishment" of making any kind of deal at all with countries that bluster and feigns outrage until the U.S. gives them all they want.


  

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Re: I Thought, 'Crap! A 25% Tarrif on Imported Steel?'
Reply #7 - Mar 7th, 2018 at 7:12am
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SnarkySack wrote on Mar 6th, 2018 at 9:17pm:
It's way to early to tell what the eventual outcome will be.  I don't know why people don't learn that whatever Trump is saying at any given moment is not his dogma that he'll stick with, it's a negotiating position. 

China is not going to want to stop selling steel to the U.S. and of course they don't want to give the U.S. government twenty-five percent of the selling price when they do sell it.  So they'll make an offer.  Probably lowering tariffs on U.S. exports to China or some otehr benefit to the U.S.  Trump will make a counter offer and both sides will bluster and claim outrage.  Except the Chinese won't have to bluster and feign outrage too much because they have CNN and FOX to do that for them.  Eventually Trump and the Chinese will come to an agreement.

That's how the leaders of every other country except the United States deal with each other.  American statists are shocked because they are used to president who give away the store for the sake of the "accomplishment" of making any kind of deal at all with countries that bluster and feigns outrage until the U.S. gives them all they want.


Sounds like a good analysis to me, thanks.
  
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Re: I Thought, 'Crap! A 25% Tarrif on Imported Steel?'
Reply #8 - Mar 7th, 2018 at 1:12pm
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SnarkySack wrote on Mar 6th, 2018 at 9:17pm:
It's way to early to tell what the eventual outcome will be.  I don't know why people don't learn that whatever Trump is saying at any given moment is not his dogma that he'll stick with, it's a negotiating position. 


I don't know why either, but I know it's true about Trump. It's not intentional though, even though some may want to make him out as a wise old fox. There's too much evidence to show otherwise.

Quote:
China is not going to want to stop selling steel to the U.S. and of course they don't want to give the U.S. government twenty-five percent of the selling price when they do sell it.  So they'll make an offer.  Probably lowering tariffs on U.S. exports to China or some otehr benefit to the U.S.  Trump will make a counter offer and both sides will bluster and claim outrage.  Except the Chinese won't have to bluster and feign outrage too much because they have CNN and FOX to do that for them.  Eventually Trump and the Chinese will come to an agreement.


First you said it was too early to tell, now you're telling me the endpoint of the negotiation. Who do you think you're talking to burnsred? The Chief or a six year old?

Don't be afraid to get into that which appears to be complilcated to you on trade negotiations. I'll likely be able to handle it!

Quote:
That's how the leaders of every other country except the United States deal with each other.  American statists are shocked because they are used to president who give away the store for the sake of the "accomplishment" of making any kind of deal at all with countries that bluster and feigns outrage until the U.S. gives them all they want.


You seem to be trying to make a case for Trump being a very wise negotiator, or at least a better negotiator than his predecessors? And also attempting to tell me how negotiations are carried out by the US with other countries.

my advice to you would be to concentrate a lot more heavily on negotiating power of the countries you wish to discuss. As well as a few finer points of negotiation such as equitable positions.

Did I ever tell you that I negotiated professionally on a union/management level for a few years? I'm pretty sure I did.

I'm quite interested in a discussion on the international negotiations that are going on right now between the US and other countries.



  
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SnarkySack
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Re: I Thought, 'Crap! A 25% Tarrif on Imported Steel?'
Reply #9 - Mar 7th, 2018 at 6:54pm
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Sicklers Dink wrote on Mar 7th, 2018 at 1:12pm:
I don't know why either, but I know it's true about Trump. It's not intentional though, even though some may want to make him out as a wise old fox. There's too much evidence to show otherwise.


I'm not sure I buy the theory that Trump became a multi-billionaire by sheer luck.  But in this case it doesn't really require being a wise dog or whatever.  Just common sense tells you that people don't offer good deals when you start by giving them everything they want up front.


Quote:
First you said it was too early to tell, now you're telling me the endpoint of the negotiation. Who do you think you're talking to burnsred? The Chief or a six year old?


I'm not telling you the end point of the negotiations.  I'm only stating the obvious which is that their will be negotiations.  If you mean that it's not clear that there will be a deal, you could be right.  It's possible that China will meekly go along with giving us 25% of their U.S. steel sales profits.  Possible, but highly unlikely.

Quote:
Don't be afraid to get into that which appears to be complilcated to you on trade negotiations. I'll likely be able to handle it!


You seem to be trying to make a case for Trump being a very wise negotiator, or at least a better negotiator than his predecessors? And also attempting to tell me how negotiations are carried out by the US with other countries.

my advice to you would be to concentrate a lot more heavily on negotiating power of the countries you wish to discuss. As well as a few finer points of negotiation such as equitable positions.

Did I ever tell you that I negotiated professionally on a union/management level for a few years? I'm pretty sure I did.

I'm quite interested in a discussion on the international negotiations that are going on right now between the US and other countries.





You sound imminently qualified to teach me then.  Just as you deferred to my expertise on reading interventions, I'll defer to yours on negotiations and await your words of wisdom.


  

I used to be burnsred . . .
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