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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) 45,000 Americans Killed Without Health Care Yearly. (Read 1234 times)
Don_G
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Re: 45,000 Americans Killed Without Health Care Yearly.
Reply #10 - May 1st, 2018 at 5:40pm
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RubyHypatia wrote on May 1st, 2018 at 4:44pm:
And how many Canadians die waiting for treatment?


None Ruby. If immediate care is required then they can go to France of the UK which both have the best in the world. And it will cost less than an American would have to pay in his own country.

However, let's always keep in mind that Canada's health care is rated better than the US's and our outcome is better.

If Canadians were dying waiting for health care then wouldn't that indicate that our medical outcome would be worse Ruby?

Ruby lesson number 1.

1. Never attempt to debate healthcare with a Canadian. You'll always end up getting your ass kicked around the block.

We do it all better Ruby and all the modern countries with universal health care do it better than your country too. What can I say Ruby, other than you're a dumb kunht with a careless mouth?

Talk to burnsred. He got his ass kicked on the health care topic so many times he's disallowed himself to even talk to me anymore! LOL
  
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Jeff
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Re: 45,000 Americans Killed Without Health Care Yearly.
Reply #11 - May 1st, 2018 at 8:02pm
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SkyChief wrote on May 1st, 2018 at 5:30pm:
“If you demand the collective to pay for your medical expenses, then be prepared for the collective to demand to make your medical decisions for you.”
― A.E. Samaan
Yep.
  
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RubyHypatia
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Re: 45,000 Americans Killed Without Health Care Yearly.
Reply #12 - May 1st, 2018 at 8:50pm
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Crossing the Border for Care
Frustrated by long waits, some Canadians are heading to the U.S. for medical treatment.
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/articles/2016-08-03/canadians-increas...
  
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RubyHypatia
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Re: 45,000 Americans Killed Without Health Care Yearly.
Reply #13 - May 1st, 2018 at 8:59pm
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The Pitfalls of Single-Payer Health Care: Canada’s Cautionary Tale
https://www.nationalreview.com/2017/04/canada-single-payer-health-care-system-fa...
  
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Don_G
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Re: 45,000 Americans Killed Without Health Care Yearly.
Reply #14 - May 2nd, 2018 at 1:24pm
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RubyHypatia wrote on May 1st, 2018 at 8:59pm:
The Pitfalls of Single-Payer Health Care: Canada’s Cautionary Tale
https://www.nationalreview.com/2017/04/canada-single-payer-health-care-system-fa...


You Americans can't win in a discussion on health care Ruby, but I always invite you to try. Somebody needs to carry the ball for burnsred anyway.

Canadians cross the border for health care and so do Americans. If we take into account a 10 to 1 population ratio then it appears that Americans are doing it equally or even moreso. I'll argue successfully for ours no matter what you try to argue on comparisons.

Canada's and all the other countries with government, universal health care are all BETTER than the US's.

Hit me with your next shot daddy's little fatty!
  
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The Opposition
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Re: 45,000 Americans Killed Without Health Care Yearly.
Reply #15 - May 3rd, 2018 at 1:22am
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SkyChief wrote on May 1st, 2018 at 5:30pm:
“If you demand the collective to pay for your medical expenses, then be prepared for the collective to demand to make your medical decisions for you.”
― A.E. Samaan


A reasonable collective would require that fat people exercise and smokers at least stop smoking.

Our collective will buy any sob story and put what's in front of their face at the front of the line, because they "need" it, at the expense of the responsible people who got an unlucky or genetic disease. Because those people aren't in the spotlight right now.

I hate to say it, but the reason communism won't work is the same as the reason libertarianism won't work.

Stupid people. People the media has suckered.

Quote:
You Americans can't win in a discussion on health care Ruby,


Ignore her link more. Then everyone else can ignore yours and we can collectively agree that facts don't matter.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Don_G
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Re: 45,000 Americans Killed Without Health Care Yearly.
Reply #16 - May 3rd, 2018 at 1:27am
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The Opposition wrote on May 3rd, 2018 at 1:22am:
A reasonable collective would require that fat people exercise and smokers at least stop smoking.

Our collective will buy any sob story and put what's in front of their face at the front of the line, because they "need" it, at the expense of the responsible people who got an unlucky or genetic disease. Because those people aren't in the spotlight right now.

I hate to say it, but the reason communism won't work is the same as the reason libertarianism won't work.

Stupid people. People the media has suckered.


Ignore her link more. Then everyone else can ignore yours and we can collectively agree that facts don't matter.


It's all as simple as just providing group insurance for all the people at an affordable cost. My wife and I can get it for about $125 a month. And btw, it's rated better than the US's.

Government can do that because it's not in the business to make a profit. It's in the business to get the job done.

And too, Canada's cost per capita is a little more than half as much as yours in the US.

You figure it out!

Our health care system doesn't fuk with people because they smoke or are overweight. We take a socially responsible position and attempt to educate them on living healthy.

Oh, and it workd better than your system too. Our medical outcome is better, our infant mortality is lower, and our life expectancy is higher.

And I'm sure there are more differences to brag about but we'll leave that up your ass for you for now!
  
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The Opposition
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Re: 45,000 Americans Killed Without Health Care Yearly.
Reply #17 - May 3rd, 2018 at 3:03am
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It's all as simple as just providing group insurance for all the people at an affordable cost. My wife and I can get it for about $125 a month. And btw, it's rated better than the US's.

Government can do that because it's not in the business to make a profit. It's in the business to get the job done.


It's also not immune from social reprisal. It lets one braindead kid die and the media will make a stink. Then everyone will turn against it.

Even the government does not have infinite resources. Even the government must eventually choose to let one die that costs ten billion dollars to save, and instead save ten billion who each cost $1 to save.

The people will cry that it's a monster, because they're the media's puppets. The media does this because of power. Any time anything works well, the people who want power can replace it with something that works poorly and turn the excess into profit. This is their game. If your health care system does work this well, eventually they'll kill it.

Quote:
Our health care system doesn't fuk with people because they smoke or are overweight. We take a socially responsible position and attempt to educate them on living healthy.


That's not very socially responsible, letting the people who make good choices and save the system resources lose so the people who scarf nachos and chain smoke can gobble those resources up.

The fair thing for an authoritarian government to do is at least make them show an effort. If they can't be bothered to spend their time - their resources - on themselves, on getting healthier, why should anyone else spend their resources? You're just valuing the resources of the smoker as inherently more valuable than those of the non-smoker.

Wouldn't social responsibility be treating these two people equally? The smoker must then show he's willing to spend his resources on his health before he is entitled to the resources of others.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Jeff
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Re: 45,000 Americans Killed Without Health Care Yearly.
Reply #18 - May 3rd, 2018 at 8:03am
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The Opposition wrote on May 3rd, 2018 at 1:22am:
A reasonable collective would require that fat people exercise and smokers at least stop smoking.

Our collective will buy any sob story and put what's in front of their face at the front of the line, because they "need" it, at the expense of the responsible people who got an unlucky or genetic disease. Because those people aren't in the spotlight right now.

The problem with death panels is they are not "the collective", they just have been granted power by the "leaders".

It's the "collective" of productive people who pay for it all and don't actually have a voice in any of the decisions made in their name.
  
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Jeff
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Re: 45,000 Americans Killed Without Health Care Yearly.
Reply #19 - May 3rd, 2018 at 8:09am
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The Opposition wrote on May 3rd, 2018 at 1:22am:
I hate to say it, but the reason communism won't work is the same as the reason libertarianism won't work.

Stupid people. People the media has suckered.
You still don't get that the philosophy of individual liberty and individual rights requires only a well designed and strictly limited government so that people can be free to pursue their own lives. Let's call the freedom to pursue your own life "individual liberty". The only requirements are a government that protects everyone's rights and liberty equally.

To establish a "socialist system" requires a government with power over every aspect of everyone's life, because almost no one will actually live as a communist unless they are forced to. The few voluntarily communist communities that have been established have always failed, usually rapidly, because even in biological family groups, almost no humans are communistic.
  
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