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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure (Read 4915 times)
Jeff
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #270 - Mar 12th, 2019 at 7:45pm
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SkyChief wrote on Mar 12th, 2019 at 6:58pm:
Trump keeps pressure on them while simultaneously maintaining channels of communication with the two leaders.   
What sort of pressure? Threatening trade wars while they prepare for a shooting war?

Trump likes Young Kim too... has Trump's "pressure" or his "communicating" with Kim been effective?
  
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SkyChief
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #271 - Mar 12th, 2019 at 7:55pm
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Jeff wrote on Mar 12th, 2019 at 7:45pm:
Trump likes Young Kim too... has Trump's "pressure" or his "communicating" with Kim been effective?
Sanctions have been most effective.

Young Kim wants them eased but Trump said

"No, you must make concessions if you want the US to lift sanctions."

Kim said

"Fine - keep the sanctions, then.  But let's get together every now and then to discuss peace.  Eventually one of us is bound to cave in."
  
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Jeff
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #272 - Mar 13th, 2019 at 6:41am
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SkyChief wrote on Mar 12th, 2019 at 7:55pm:
Sanctions have been most effective.
What have they accomplished?
  
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SkyChief
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #273 - Mar 13th, 2019 at 11:21am
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Jeff wrote on Mar 13th, 2019 at 6:41am:
What have they accomplished?

They have sent a powerful message to Kim.  Sanctions have exacted a heavy toll on the North Korean economy. Young Kim understands this and he knows that the US will continue to pressure North Korea to denuclearize.

Sanctions are also effective as a method of punishment for cyberattacks, money laundering, and human rights violations. 

Kim knows that when he misbehaves, he'll be disciplined by Daddy Trump.   Grin

Back to Venezuela. ...

Today, SoS Pompeo said he will "deliver democracy" to Venezuela, ousting leader Maduro.  He might use the Military if necessary.

“As the president said, every option is on the table to deliver to the Venezuelan people the democracy they deserve."

E.U. Foreign Affairs Rep. Federica Mogherini made it clear to Secretary Pompeo that military force will not be be acceptable:

"The crisis that affects [Venezuela] has political and institutional causes - it's not a natural disaster, and it's solution needs to be peaceful, political, and democratic.

We believe that NO military development from inside or outside of the country would be acceptable."
  
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Jeff
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #274 - Mar 13th, 2019 at 2:49pm
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SkyChief wrote on Mar 13th, 2019 at 11:21am:
They have sent a powerful message to Kim.  Sanctions have exacted a heavy toll on the North Korean economy. Young Kim understands this and he knows that the US will continue to pressure North Korea to denuclearize.

Sanctions are also effective as a method of punishment for cyberattacks, money laundering, and human rights violations. 

I think you're engaged in wishful thinking.
  
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Jeff
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #275 - Mar 13th, 2019 at 2:50pm
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SkyChief wrote on Mar 13th, 2019 at 11:21am:
Back to Venezuela. ...

Today, SoS Pompeo said he will "deliver democracy" to Venezuela, ousting leader Maduro.  He might use the Military if necessary.

“As the president said, every option is on the table to deliver to the Venezuelan people the democracy they deserve."

E.U. Foreign Affairs Rep. Federica Mogherini made it clear to Secretary Pompeo that military force will not be be acceptable:

"The crisis that affects [Venezuela] has political and institutional causes - it's not a natural disaster, and it's solution needs to be peaceful, political, and democratic.

We believe that NO military development from inside or outside of the country would be acceptable."
What makes it any of the EU's business?

Incidentally, why would we want to wish a democratic government on the Venezuelan people?
  
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SkyChief
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #276 - Mar 13th, 2019 at 4:25pm
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Jeff wrote on Mar 13th, 2019 at 2:50pm:
Incidentally, why would we want to wish a democratic government on the Venezuelan people?

Probably the same reason the US wished a democratic government for all of these countries;

Panama,
Honduras,
Nicaragua,
Chile,
Haiti,
Dominican Republic,
Korea,
Japan,
Philippines, 
Bosnia,
Liberia,
Guatemala,
Brazil,
et. al...
  
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kaz
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #277 - Mar 13th, 2019 at 5:16pm
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SkyChief wrote on Mar 12th, 2019 at 11:32am:
I hope you're not referring to me. 

BREAKING NEWS

SoS Mike Pompeo said that all remaining staff at the U.S. embassy in Venezuela would be withdrawn, as turmoil worsens in Venezuela's capital city of Caracas.

"The presence of U.S. diplomatic staff at the [Caracas] embassy has become a constraint on U.S. policy." -  Secretary Pompeo

https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/yw8kjk/pompeo-us-diplomats-out-of-venezuelas

This is a little alarming.   Does this pullout mean that he intends to invade Venezuela for a regime change?

Pulling diplomats out of an embassy typically precedes a military strike, right?


That's funny.  You say you hope I'm not referring to you, then you go on again with your stupid Democrat party shit.  Democrats on the board would be masturbating right now at your post.  You jump to the most extreme explanation.  You're such a chick.  They obviously would want to get our diplomats out of an unstable country.  That air strikes are coming is pure conjecture.  And Trump hasn't been remotely Obama, W or Clinton with the military.

  

Contest winner:  I predicted Kaz' meltdown
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Jeff
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #278 - Mar 13th, 2019 at 5:47pm
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SkyChief wrote on Mar 13th, 2019 at 4:25pm:
Probably the same reason the US wished a democratic government for all of these countries;

Panama,
Honduras,
Nicaragua,
Chile,
Haiti,
Dominican Republic,
Korea,
Japan,
Philippines, 
Bosnia,
Liberia,
Guatemala,
Brazil,
et. al...
Sad isn't it? Making the World Safe for Democracy and exporting democracy around the world has had very bad effects, just as too much democracy is having a bad effect on America. Cry It's the legacy of the Progressive Era.

Edit: Chile didn't turn out too bad I think... And South Korea was doing well for decades.

Why did we ever give North Korea back to the communists? To the Soviet installed Kim regime?

That's another huge injustice our past government should be held accountable for.
  
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SkyChief
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #279 - Mar 13th, 2019 at 5:54pm
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kaz wrote on Mar 13th, 2019 at 5:16pm:
 You jump to the most extreme explanation.   That air strikes are coming is pure conjecture.  And Trump hasn't been remotely Obama, W or Clinton with the military.

As it turns out, I was right to ask if the withdrawal of US diplomats was preparation for military intervention.

earlier today,,  Pompeo said

"...every option is on the table to deliver to the Venezuelan people the democracy they deserve."

When he says EVERY OPTION, that's code for military option.  The thing is, it's not Pompeo's job to "deliver democracy" to Venezuela.   The US should not interfere in the political turmoil in Venezuela.

The Foreign Affairs Rep recognized Pompeo's hint of military force, and quickly warned:

"The crisis that affects [Venezuela] has political and institutional causes - it's not a natural disaster, and it's solution needs to be peaceful, political, and democratic.

We believe that NO military development from inside or outside of the country would be acceptable."
  
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