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SkyChief
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #70 - May 15th, 2018 at 11:09am
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The Opposition wrote on May 14th, 2018 at 10:35pm:
This happened because the number of people living off resources obtained by others grew beyond the ability of those obtaining the resources to support them.

I'm trying to explain to Troll and Troller that it will still happen even if the people living off resources obtained by others get them voluntarily. It's not terribly likely that this would actually happen that way, but it would still cause a collapse.

Yes.  The Maduro government has been scrimping on the CLAP provisions (staple food packages).

Initially these CLAP packages were handed out by the government’s neighborhood committees in poor areas for a nominal cost. They included products such as chicken, eggs, pasta, oil, corn and wheat flour and canned tuna.

Today, these CLAP bags have much fewer products than the first packages. Instead of 2 kilograms of rice or sugar, there is one. There was no tuna or canned beef.

The number of dependent citizens has outnumbered the independent... the perfect recipe for economic/social collapse.
  
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Jeff
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #71 - May 15th, 2018 at 1:50pm
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SkyChief wrote on May 15th, 2018 at 11:09am:
Yes.  The Maduro government has been scrimping on the CLAP provisions (staple food packages).

Initially these CLAP packages were handed out by the government’s neighborhood committees in poor areas for a nominal cost. They included products such as chicken, eggs, pasta, oil, corn and wheat flour and canned tuna.

Today, these CLAP bags have much fewer products than the first packages. Instead of 2 kilograms of rice or sugar, there is one. There was no tuna or canned beef.

The number of dependent citizens has outnumbered the independent... the perfect recipe for economic/social collapse.
Yes, and the ratio depends very much on the form of government.
  
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BobK71
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #72 - May 16th, 2018 at 9:56am
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SkyChief wrote on May 9th, 2018 at 12:03pm:
Socialism is the cause of the Venezuelan misery. Venezuelans are starving, eating garbage, losing weight. Children are malnourished. Most people in Venezuela would be happy to eat out of America’s trashcans.

There are the freedom fighters of Venezuela - "la resistencia".  They oppose the socialist Maduro regime, and often are killed when identified as la resistencia.

Historically, that's how most brutal dictators behave  - when an individual, or a group of people speak out against a tyrannibal government, simply KILL them.   

https://mises.org/library/how-socialism-ruined-venezuela


Socialism is a big weakness, for sure.  But every country has some kind of weakness.  If it were not socialism, the globalists would use something else to destroy any regime/country not deemed loyal enough to their system.  Vietnam is socialist, and you don't see the same level of suffering today.

Late 19th-century Germany was a strong country in every way.  Actually, too strong for the taste of the political-financial elites then based in London.  If Germany took over world hegemony from a then heavily indebted Britain (not having nearly enough gold to redeem its paper sterling at the official rate,) it might not have been as friendly to a declining Britain as the US would.

After World War I Germany was financially destabilized by the West, first via imposing unpayable reparations, and then (after Germany fought back successfully with the reset-via-hyperinflation of 1923) by painting the country as a fairy tale and flooding it with foreign debt.  (German bonds were bought by widows and grandmothers on the streets of Chicago!)  When deflation hit after 1929, guess which country had the worst pain.

Germany was finally docile after World War II.  It might take the Western elites half a century, but they get it done.  Venezuela, like Saddam Hussein's Iraq, just made their job much easier.

You could easily argue America is truly freer than most countries.  That perception is also one of the soft-power support systems the US-led system enjoys.  Do American elites truly believe in freedom when push comes to shove?  According to the 1917 Espionage Act, it was illegal to publish any writing against the US joining World War I.  The Allies' victory depended heavily on American participation.
  
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Jeff
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #73 - May 16th, 2018 at 10:31am
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BobK71 wrote on May 16th, 2018 at 9:56am:
Socialism is a big weakness, for sure.  But every country has some kind of weakness.  If it were not socialism, the globalists would use something else to destroy any regime/country not deemed loyal enough to their system.  Vietnam is socialist, and you don't see the same level of suffering today.

Late 19th-century Germany was a strong country in every way.  Actually, too strong for the taste of the political-financial elites then based in London.  If Germany took over world hegemony from a then heavily indebted Britain (not having nearly enough gold to redeem its paper sterling at the official rate,) it might not have been as friendly to a declining Britain as the US would.

After World War I Germany was financially destabilized by the West, first via imposing unpayable reparations, and then (after Germany fought back successfully with the reset-via-hyperinflation of 1923) by painting the country as a fairy tale and flooding it with foreign debt.  (German bonds were bought by widows and grandmothers on the streets of Chicago!)  When deflation hit after 1929, guess which country had the worst pain.

Germany was finally docile after World War II.  It might take the Western elites half a century, but they get it done.  Venezuela, like Saddam Hussein's Iraq, just made their job much easier.

You could easily argue America is truly freer than most countries.  That perception is also one of the soft-power support systems the US-led system enjoys.  Do American elites truly believe in freedom when push comes to shove?  According to the 1917 Espionage Act, it was illegal to publish any writing against the US joining World War I.  The Allies' victory depended heavily on American participation.
Bad governments have been the bane of humanity since governments were created.

U.S. involvement in WWI was a "progressive" enterprise undertaken by "progressives" with the intention of spreading "progressive" democracy across the entire world by creating (when the war was won) a "League of Nations" that would govern the nations of the world and lead them into "progressive" ways.

It is fundamental to "progressive" thinking that a good "progressive" outcome justifies whatever must be done to see that outcome accomplished.

America was more free than anyone anywhere ever, as long as our government was limited.

But limited government makes it virtually impossible for "progressives" to accomplish their goals.

"Progressive" goals (such as creating an Empire to bring the ideals of American limited government to all of North America, or to help industrialize America for the common good, or to create a "socialist system") require government power with few if any limits.
  
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SkyChief
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #74 - May 16th, 2018 at 12:27pm
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BobK71 wrote on May 16th, 2018 at 9:56am:
You could easily argue America is truly freer than most countries.  That perception is also one of the soft-power support systems the US-led system enjoys.  Do American elites truly believe in freedom when push comes to shove?  According to the 1917 Espionage Act, it was illegal to publish any writing against the US joining World War I.  The Allies' victory depended heavily on American participation.

This is interesting (and very true).

It's ironic that Wilson promised to keep the US neutral in WW I,  broke this promise by declaring war on Germany, and then signed a bill that would make anyone who acknowledged his broken promise a criminal!! 

The worst (and most anti-libertarian) president in US history, imo.   Angry

Jeff wrote on May 16th, 2018 at 10:31am:
U.S. involvement in WWI was a "progressive" enterprise undertaken by "progressives" with the intention of spreading "progressive" democracy across the entire world by creating (when the war was won) a "League of Nations" that would govern the nations of the world and lead them into "progressive" ways.

Yep.  League of Nations.  Another Wilson boondoggle. Morphed into the United Nations. designed specifically to create US imperialism. 

Today:  US has over 800 Military bases spread across the globe - engaged in SEVEN wars/conflicts.  Wilson would be so pleased.
  
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Jeff
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #75 - May 16th, 2018 at 3:05pm
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SkyChief wrote on May 16th, 2018 at 12:27pm:
This is interesting (and very true).

It's ironic that Wilson promised to keep the US neutral in WW I,  broke this promise by declaring war on Germany, and then signed a bill that would make anyone who acknowledged his broken promise a criminal!! 

The worst (and most anti-libertarian) president in US history, imo.   Angry

Yep.  League of Nations.  Another Wilson boondoggle. Morphed into the United Nations. designed specifically to create US imperialism. 

Today:  US has over 800 Military bases spread across the globe - engaged in SEVEN wars/conflicts.  Wilson would be so pleased.
There's this part of it too Chief-

https://www.cato.org/publications/policy-analysis/risky-business-role-arms-sales...
  
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SkyChief
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #76 - May 18th, 2018 at 1:45pm
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"As Mr. Maduro runs for re-election on Sunday, discontent in the barracks is at an all-time high, current and former military officers say. Shortages of food, evaporating salaries and desertions have turned the armed forces into a cauldron of conspiracies against Mr. Maduro, these people say...

Amid the worst economic crisis in decades, many Venezuelans are urging the armed forces to take matters into their own hands, in a country where the military has long been the ultimate arbiter of power. "

https://www.wsj.com/articles/pressure-cooker-discontent-rises-in-venezuela-milit...



To think that the upcoming "election" isn't going to be rigged would be naiive.  From the WSJ account, it seems like a coup might be developing.  Most Venezuelans are very dissatisfied with Maduro. Clearly, the higher-ranking military officers want new leadership - and they have the means to make that happen - no matter how "rigged" the upcoming election is.
  
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Don_G
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #77 - May 18th, 2018 at 1:51pm
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We know one thing for sure and that is that if a small country is about to experience a coup against the elected government,  the US has been involved in it's dirty tricks.

The list of countries grows longer and the number of lives destroyed by the US is already in the millions in several countries.
  
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SkyChief
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #78 - May 20th, 2018 at 6:29pm
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The United States will not recognize the result of Venezuela’s presidential election on Sunday, U.S. Deputy Secretary of State John Sullivan told journalists.

Venezuelan President Nicolas Maduro was seeking a six-year term in a Sunday election boycotted by the opposition and condemned by foes as the “coronation” of a dictator. Results are expected by late evening.

“We don’t want to damage the country in a way that makes it difficult to repair after democracy is restored,” said Sullivan.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-argentina-g20-sullivan/u-s-will-not-recognize...



Today's election is a sham - there aren't many people who are naiive enough to think it isn't.   Jesus Christ himself would lose to Maduro if he was a candidate in today's election.

The inflation rate in Venezuela is over 18,000%   Shocked  The average monthly Venezuelan paycheck can't even buy a dozen eggs and a loaf of bread.

“The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people’s money.”  - Margaret Thatcher
  
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SkyChief
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Re: Venezuela - A Dismal Socialist Failure
Reply #79 - May 23rd, 2018 at 2:13am
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Fasten your seat-belts, folks.

Maduro won the election!  (pass me my heart pills.)

Big loss for the Venezuelan people.  Six more years of hardship... and so on....and so on...

Maduro will remain dictator until he dies.

So sad for the people of Venezuela.   
  
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