Libertarian's Forum
Libertarian Forum to discuss politics and free market economics.
Libertarian's ForumLibertarian's ForumFreedom Forum › Austria Closing Mosques
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6 7 ... 10 Send TopicPrint
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Austria Closing Mosques (Read 997 times)
The Opposition
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 7211
Joined: Apr 30th, 2014
Re: Austria Closing Mosques
Reply #40 - Jun 10th, 2018 at 7:18pm
Print Post  
RubyHypatia wrote on Jun 10th, 2018 at 6:41pm:
So, to live in a libertarian society, we must allow our neighbor's dog to bark all night long?  What about my right to peace?  What if your neighbor wants to keep his pet lion in his backyard right next to where your kids play?  Would it be un-libertarian to have a law about that?


You're falling victim to Don's thinking. It shouldn't matter how dangerous a gun is to others - you should be allowed to have one.

It doesn't matter if you're a forty-nine-time convicted killer. You have the right to have a gun.

Arguably a lion is not a gun and there's no "right" to own a lion, but I still think it's the same kind of thinking.
  

Making Sci-Fi great again since 2063.

Not taking Jeff seriously until he admits this is animal abuse (which he says should be illegal): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WE-IT7_CaE4
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
SkyChief
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 7200
Joined: Aug 18th, 2014
Re: Austria Closing Mosques
Reply #41 - Jun 10th, 2018 at 7:20pm
Print Post  
Jeff wrote on Jun 10th, 2018 at 7:12pm:
People throughout human history have chosen to live in towns and cities because they perceive benefits. People who don't want to live in cities because they feel "confined" can live where land is cheaper and people are thinly scattered.

Right. And this is where libertarianism has the best chance for success - in remote, sparsely-populated areas.

Libertarianism is virtually impossible in the inner-city.  You can't move without stepping on someone's toes.

In the inner-city, liberty and freedom will always be sacrificed for safety and convenience.


Jeff wrote on Jun 10th, 2018 at 7:12pm:
As a last resort, good policing helps.

By non-lethal means, hopefully!    Smiley
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 32502
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Austria Closing Mosques
Reply #42 - Jun 10th, 2018 at 7:26pm
Print Post  
SkyChief wrote on Jun 10th, 2018 at 7:20pm:
In the inner-city, liberties and freedom will always be sacrificed for safety and convenience.


Nonsense Chief.

What evidence of this do you offer? Large "progressively" governed cities with government created welfare ghettos?

Generations of Americans moved to cities because of the freedom that cities offered them, and the opportunities.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
SkyChief
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 7200
Joined: Aug 18th, 2014
Re: Austria Closing Mosques
Reply #43 - Jun 10th, 2018 at 7:41pm
Print Post  
Jeff wrote on Jun 10th, 2018 at 7:26pm:
Nonsense Chief.

What evidence of this do you offer? Large "progressively" governed cities with government created welfare ghettos?

Generations of Americans moved to cities because of the freedom that cities offered them, and the opportunities.

All you know is what you've read about in books and seen in movies.   

I live in the most densely-populated city in the US (*).  More densely populated than NYC.   I know exactly what it means when local government sacrifices liberty and freedom for safety.

I can legally grow and smoke cannabis to my heart's content.  However, our next-door neighbor cannot.  His house is built within 300 feet of a public school, so he could be arrested/prosecuted for using weed.

There are other examples, but this one is sufficient. 


*
Highest Population Densities by US Metropolitan Areas
Rank      Metropolitan Areas                               Population Per Square km
1      Los Angeles-Long Beach-Anaheim, CA            1,046
2      New York-Newark-Jersey City, NY-NJ-PA           929
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 32502
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Austria Closing Mosques
Reply #44 - Jun 10th, 2018 at 8:03pm
Print Post  
SkyChief wrote on Jun 10th, 2018 at 7:41pm:
All you know is what you've read about in books and seen in movies.   

I live in the most densely-populated city in the US (*).  More densely populated than NYC.   I know exactly what it means when local government sacrifices liberty and freedom for safety.

There you are, you've identified the problem, the government you lived under in your city.

That's much more accurate than blaming the people who live in the city with you.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
thermf5
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 1912
Location: sin city
Joined: Aug 19th, 2017
Re: Austria Closing Mosques
Reply #45 - Jun 10th, 2018 at 8:32pm
Print Post  
SkyChief wrote on Jun 10th, 2018 at 5:57pm:
Lemme put it this way:

The smaller the population, the better.  The more acreage per person, the better. 

In confined/high-density areas, such as inner cities, naturally there's more chance of one person encroaching on the rights of another, even though no malice was intended.

Barking dogs would be a classic example of this.  That's why most densely populated cities have barking dog ordinances.  Highly anti-libertarian, but very necessary.

if u live in a dencly populated area u have to put with   things to respect the rights of others but from my own personal experince that dose not work for alot of people cival rights in a denly populated area is not with in the thought proses of most old school nyc being an exception ur right most people cant mind there own bizness
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 32502
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Austria Closing Mosques
Reply #46 - Jun 11th, 2018 at 7:03am
Print Post  
thermf5 wrote on Jun 10th, 2018 at 8:32pm:
if u live in a dencly populated area u have to put with   things to respect the rights of others but from my own personal experince that dose not work for alot of people cival rights in a denly populated area is not with in the thought proses of most old school nyc being an exception ur right most people cant mind there own bizness
Anybody can mind their own business. The best way to accomplish this is to teach children to mind their own business.

If you are teaching children to be part of a collective, then there is no such thing as private business. If an individual is hiding something in a collectivist system, they are acting as an individual, which is a terrible sin according to collectivist theory. In other words, expect things to get worse... Cry
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
RubyHypatia
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 2555
Location: Greer, SC
Joined: May 12th, 2011
Re: Austria Closing Mosques
Reply #47 - Jun 11th, 2018 at 2:32pm
Print Post  
It is not un-libertarian to have an ordinance against keeping dangerous animals.  My right to not be attacked by a wild pet is more important than someone's desire to own such a pet.  Libertarianism seeks to maximize freedom, but freedom has limits.  We don't have the freedom to murder.  Our freedom stops where it would infringe on other people's freedom.  If my children are killed by the neighbor's pet lion, there goes my children's freedom.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
thermf5
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 1912
Location: sin city
Joined: Aug 19th, 2017
Re: Austria Closing Mosques
Reply #48 - Jun 11th, 2018 at 6:24pm
Print Post  
RubyHypatia wrote on Jun 11th, 2018 at 2:32pm:
It is not un-libertarian to have an ordinance against keeping dangerous animals.  My right to not be attacked by a wild pet is more important than someone's desire to own such a pet.  Libertarianism seeks to maximize freedom, but freedom has limits.  We don't have the freedom to murder.  Our freedom stops where it would infringe on other people's freedom.  If my children are killed by the neighbor's pet lion, there goes my children's freedom.

i fear dogs i dont want to be atcked by dogs do i want then to be illgle no i do my best to stay away from them and if u nabor get a pet lion move sell or rent out ur property
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
The Opposition
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 7211
Joined: Apr 30th, 2014
Re: Austria Closing Mosques
Reply #49 - Jun 11th, 2018 at 10:43pm
Print Post  
RubyHypatia wrote on Jun 11th, 2018 at 2:32pm:
It is not un-libertarian to have an ordinance against keeping dangerous animals.  My right to not be attacked by a wild pet is more important than someone's desire to own such a pet.  Libertarianism seeks to maximize freedom, but freedom has limits.  We don't have the freedom to murder.  Our freedom stops where it would infringe on other people's freedom.  If my children are killed by the neighbor's pet lion, there goes my children's freedom.


You can make this argument just as well against guns, though. Don's right not to be shot is more important than your desire to own a gun.
  

Making Sci-Fi great again since 2063.

Not taking Jeff seriously until he admits this is animal abuse (which he says should be illegal): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WE-IT7_CaE4
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6 7 ... 10
Send TopicPrint
 
Libertarian's ForumLibertarian's ForumFreedom Forum › Austria Closing Mosques
Libertarian's Forum

Libertarian's Forum Information Rules, Agreement and Privacy Policy