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SkyChief
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1st Lady Melania Speaks Out Against Zero Tolerance Immigration Policy
Jun 17th, 2018 at 5:05pm
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Today, Melania Trump uncharacteristically waded into a fierce debate around immigration, pushing for bipartisan cooperation to end the separation of migrant children from their parents at the border.

The detention of children apart from their parents is a result of the policy mandated by Attorney General Jeff Sessions, and there is no law that requires family separation. As such, Congressional action is not necessary to stop it.

A.G. Sessions harsly responded:

"Non-citizens who cross our borders unlawfully, between our ports of entry, with children are NOT an exception.  They are the ones who broke the law.  They are the ones who endangered their own children on their trek."

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/immigration/first-lady-melania-trump-makes-stat...
  
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Jeff
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Re: 1st Lady Melania Speaks Out Against Zero Tolerance Immigration Policy
Reply #1 - Jun 17th, 2018 at 5:13pm
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SkyChief wrote on Jun 17th, 2018 at 5:05pm:
Today, Melania Trump uncharacteristically waded into a fierce debate around immigration, pushing for bipartisan cooperation to end the separation of migrant children from their parents at the border.

The detention of children apart from their parents is a result of the policy mandated by Attorney General Jeff Sessions, and there is no law that requires family separation. As such, Congressional action is not necessary to stop it.

He is probably justifying it as "necessary and proper" to enforce our current immigration laws, which Congress seems unwilling to change.

That means the Executive branch is obligated to enforce our current immigration laws.

Saying "If you come to the U.S. illegally and bring your children, we will separate you from your children" has cut down on people bringing children with them, which would mean Session's policy is working to better enforce the immigration laws that Congress has given him to respect and enforce.

Edit: Mrs. Trump, bless her heart, was lobbying Congress to emend our immigration laws. Good for her.
  
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Jeff
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Re: 1st Lady Melania Speaks Out Against Zero Tolerance Immigration Policy
Reply #2 - Jun 17th, 2018 at 5:19pm
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Would it be a good idea to say that if you immigrate to the U.S., neither you or your family is eligible for any government assistance until both you and your wife/husband become Citizens?

Who would that offend besides the communists?
  
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The Opposition
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Re: 1st Lady Melania Speaks Out Against Zero Tolerance Immigration Policy
Reply #3 - Jun 17th, 2018 at 7:35pm
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Jeff wrote on Jun 17th, 2018 at 5:19pm:
Would it be a good idea to say that if you immigrate to the U.S., neither you or your family is eligible for any government assistance until both you and your wife/husband become Citizens?

Who would that offend besides the communists?


Libertarians. Actual libertarians.

Assistance as a whole needs to go. Assistance to "illegal" immigrants does not need to go any sooner.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Re: 1st Lady Melania Speaks Out Against Zero Tolerance Immigration Policy
Reply #4 - Jun 17th, 2018 at 7:49pm
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The Opposition wrote on Jun 17th, 2018 at 7:35pm:
Libertarians. Actual libertarians.

Assistance as a whole needs to go. Assistance to "illegal" immigrants does not need to go any sooner.
As a means of discouraging illegal immigration, it would go a long way...

You say anarchists wouldn't like it because it would be "unfair"?
  
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The Opposition
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Re: 1st Lady Melania Speaks Out Against Zero Tolerance Immigration Policy
Reply #5 - Jun 17th, 2018 at 7:59pm
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Jeff wrote on Jun 17th, 2018 at 7:49pm:
As a means of discouraging illegal immigration, it would go a long way...

You say anarchists wouldn't like it because it would be "unfair"?


Immigration should be encouraged, not discouraged.

Instead of nitpicking my every word, which I'm sure you'll do, just ask Tom. He won't take your bullshit.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
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Re: 1st Lady Melania Speaks Out Against Zero Tolerance Immigration Policy
Reply #6 - Jun 17th, 2018 at 8:56pm
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The Opposition wrote on Jun 17th, 2018 at 7:35pm:
Assistance as a whole needs to go. Assistance to "illegal" immigrants does not need to go any sooner.

Yes!    Smiley

A much better solution for these families fleeing oppressive governments would be to grant them Guest Visas.

The whole process would take less than 15 minutes.   The applicant fills out a Guest Visa (at any US point of entry), a cursory [DHS] background check is done to make sure the immigrant has no criminal or terrorist record, they pay a $500 "processing" fee, and within a few minutes they are issued their Guest Visa which is valid for 12 months.   Smiley  A Guest Visa may be renewed infinite times.

No more splitting up families. No more internment camps.   No more pining from the hand-wringing democrats. No more rejections to people seeking a better life.

It's such a simple solution.  And a humanitarian/libertarian one.
  
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Jeff
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Re: 1st Lady Melania Speaks Out Against Zero Tolerance Immigration Policy
Reply #7 - Jun 18th, 2018 at 7:28am
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SkyChief wrote on Jun 17th, 2018 at 8:56pm:
Yes!    Smiley

A much better solution for these families fleeing oppressive governments would be to grant them Guest Visas.

The whole process would take less than 15 minutes.   The applicant fills out a Guest Visa (at any US point of entry), a cursory [DHS] background check is done to make sure the immigrant has no criminal or terrorist record, they pay a $500 "processing" fee, and within a few minutes they are issued their Guest Visa which is valid for 12 months.   Smiley  A Guest Visa may be renewed infinite times.

No more splitting up families. No more internment camps.   No more pining from the hand-wringing democrats. No more rejections to people seeking a better life.

It's such a simple solution.  And a humanitarian/libertarian one.
That would work too, and I'm assuming people here on guest visas don't qualify for government assistance? (Which even the lizard agrees should be ended for everyone, including corporations...)
  
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Re: 1st Lady Melania Speaks Out Against Zero Tolerance Immigration Policy
Reply #8 - Jun 18th, 2018 at 9:46am
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Splitting up families, outlawing immigration, but letting it happen anyway and giving them welfare are not libertarian policies, they are the opposite.  Libertarianism would solve the illegal  alien problem by allowing desirable, hard working immigrants to enter at will, while eliminating the incentives for undesirable immigrants.

Eliminating all government assistance will discourage the lazy.  Eliminating all laws against voluntary drug use will mean that MS 13 and other drug gangs would have no U.S. market.  Legalizing prostitution will mean that there is no need to traffic girls to force them into servitude, which is likely the fate of many of the children who cross our border with their "families."

I  disagree with deliberately using family separation as a disincentive to illegal immigration.  However, I also don't buy the crocodile tears of the leftie media sob-sisters.  They are thrilled to have an issue with which to bash Trump.  They certainly are not concerned that Paul Manafort is being separated from his family in an attempt to force him to testify against Trump.

  

"I think I'll backtrack." - Jeff
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Re: 1st Lady Melania Speaks Out Against Zero Tolerance Immigration Policy
Reply #9 - Jun 18th, 2018 at 10:37am
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Snarky Sack wrote on Jun 18th, 2018 at 9:46am:
Splitting up families, outlawing immigration, but letting it happen anyway and giving them welfare are not libertarian policies, they are the opposite.  Libertarianism would solve the illegal  alien problem by allowing desirable, hard working immigrants to enter at will, while eliminating the incentives for undesirable immigrants.

Eliminating all government assistance will discourage the lazy.  Eliminating all laws against voluntary drug use will mean that MS 13 and other drug gangs would have no U.S. market.  Legalizing prostitution will mean that there is no need to traffic girls to force them into servitude, which is likely the fate of many of the children who cross our border with their "families."

I  disagree with deliberately using family separation as a disincentive to illegal immigration.  However, I also don't buy the crocodile tears of the leftie media sob-sisters.  They are thrilled to have an issue with which to bash Trump.  They certainly are not concerned that Paul Manafort is being separated from his family in an attempt to force him to testify against Trump.

For a change, I agree with you completely.

However, the President and his employees (like Jeff Sessions) are legally obligated to try to enforce the laws that Congress passes, and it looks to me as if Sessions has come up with a pretty good method of discouraging illegal immigration, short of Congress wiping out the welfare state or the Supreme Court declaring it unconstitutional, or congress enacting much more reasonable immigration laws.
  
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