Libertarian's Forum
Libertarian Forum to discuss politics and free market economics.
Libertarian's ForumLibertarian's ForumFreedom Forum › The Libertarian Party needs change
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 ... 12 Send TopicPrint
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) The Libertarian Party needs change (Read 1268 times)
The Opposition
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 7654
Joined: Apr 30th, 2014
Re: The Libertarian Party needs change
Reply #30 - Jul 29th, 2018 at 1:51pm
Print Post  
Jeff wrote on Jul 29th, 2018 at 7:37am:
What sort of solutions would you propose to this "problem" that you see that you say is caused by "capitalism"?

Certainly you are aware that "socialism" doesn't have that problem because a "better product" doesn't even exist, and often there are no products at all...


If you read the whole post I suggest that pure capitalism might actually solve this problem capitalism has created.

But you have to be willing to pay the piper.

The people who find the better products, do research on their own, and cut out the cost of advertising have to be able to prosper over those who mindlessly buy from the ad.

This means voluntary charity can't step in when people cry "I'm poor" and equalise the smart consumer with the impulse-buying stupid one, who does end up poor on the same salary.

Inflation also serves to equalise the smart consumer with the stupid one.

You have to let the smart consumer win, which means no welfare for one, and getting rid of all the things the market does to conspire against the smart consumer for two.

Then, eventually, ads will go extinct.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 34405
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: The Libertarian Party needs change
Reply #31 - Jul 29th, 2018 at 2:26pm
Print Post  
The Opposition wrote on Jul 29th, 2018 at 1:51pm:
If you read the whole post I suggest that pure capitalism might actually solve this problem capitalism has created.

But you have to be willing to pay the piper.

The people who find the better products, do research on their own, and cut out the cost of advertising have to be able to prosper over those who mindlessly buy from the ad.

This means voluntary charity can't step in when people cry "I'm poor" and equalise the smart consumer with the impulse-buying stupid one, who does end up poor on the same salary.

Inflation also serves to equalise the smart consumer with the stupid one.

You have to let the smart consumer win, which means no welfare for one, and getting rid of all the things the market does to conspire against the smart consumer for two.

Then, eventually, ads will go extinct.
Free markets would indeed be better than regulated markets, but it was free markets to begin with that found advertising useful and began using it.

Advertising is not a problem. Many businesses don't advertise and do just fine. Others spend lots of money advertising right up until they go out of business.

Smart consumers get better products for less. Not so smart consumers spend more than they need to. It's only a problem on an individual level.

What actually makes consumers smart is having to spend their own money.

Edit: That's pretty funny, the thing about "the market conspiring" to do anything at all, as if "the market" was some monolithic organization run by the Wizard of Oz. Grin

Maybe you were thinking about "the market" in an authoritarian communist country?
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Andrew_Armao
Libertarian Full Member
***
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 58
Joined: Jul 4th, 2018
Re: The Libertarian Party needs change
Reply #32 - Aug 2nd, 2018 at 6:11pm
Print Post  
The Opposition wrote on Jul 29th, 2018 at 1:51pm:
If you read the whole post I suggest that pure capitalism might actually solve this problem capitalism has created.

But you have to be willing to pay the piper.

The people who find the better products, do research on their own, and cut out the cost of advertising have to be able to prosper over those who mindlessly buy from the ad.

This means voluntary charity can't step in when people cry "I'm poor" and equalise the smart consumer with the impulse-buying stupid one, who does end up poor on the same salary.

Inflation also serves to equalise the smart consumer with the stupid one.

You have to let the smart consumer win, which means no welfare for one, and getting rid of all the things the market does to conspire against the smart consumer for two.

Then, eventually, ads will go ex1tinct.


Good sense. I agree that many pitfalls for individuals are from governments "helping" when really, they are rewarding improper behaviors. Intitlments are idiotic and improper.

Elected officials who write these laws never think of unintended consequences or suggestions to behavior. Evey law is a suggestion to behavior. Consequences for murder don't stop it, it but detours some from doing it, at least, by design.
  

Andrew J Armao
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 34405
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: The Libertarian Party needs change
Reply #33 - Aug 2nd, 2018 at 6:17pm
Print Post  
I'm on tenterhooks awaiting your reply lizard... Smiley
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
The Opposition
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 7654
Joined: Apr 30th, 2014
Re: The Libertarian Party needs change
Reply #34 - Aug 2nd, 2018 at 10:04pm
Print Post  
Jeff wrote on Aug 2nd, 2018 at 6:17pm:
I'm on tenterhooks awaiting your reply lizard... Smiley


I explained to you exactly how a free market mechanism worked and all you could do was make fun of my claim without addressing it.

I explained how advertising is a problem. You couldn't address that either.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 34405
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: The Libertarian Party needs change
Reply #35 - Aug 3rd, 2018 at 7:29am
Print Post  
Andrew_Armao wrote on Aug 2nd, 2018 at 6:11pm:
Good sense. I agree that many pitfalls for individuals are from governments "helping" when really, they are rewarding improper behaviors. Intitlments are idiotic and improper.

Elected officials who write these laws never think of unintended consequences or suggestions to behavior. Evey law is a suggestion to behavior. Consequences for murder don't stop it, it but detours some from doing it, at least, by design.
Governments do all sorts of damage when they claim to be trying to help-

https://www.cato.org/publications/policy-analysis/why-does-federal-government-is...
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 34405
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: The Libertarian Party needs change
Reply #36 - Aug 3rd, 2018 at 7:36am
Print Post  
The Opposition wrote on Aug 2nd, 2018 at 10:04pm:
I explained to you exactly how a free market mechanism worked and all you could do was make fun of my claim without addressing it.

I explained how advertising is a problem. You couldn't address that either.
Advertising is a part of how markets work. Ads were created by free market competitors. Ads are useful to both buyers and sellers. If you don't like them, or think your mind is not strong enough to resist them, you should ignore ads and try to avoid them.

If you happen to need or want something, and are looking for a product that suits your needs at a price you can afford, you start most often by looking at ads, which contain lots of information about products and prices. Need a car? Look at the 'cars for sale' ads.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
The Opposition
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 7654
Joined: Apr 30th, 2014
Re: The Libertarian Party needs change
Reply #37 - Aug 4th, 2018 at 8:37am
Print Post  
Jeff wrote on Aug 3rd, 2018 at 7:36am:
Advertising is a part of how markets work. Ads were created by free market competitors. Ads are useful to both buyers and sellers. If you don't like them, or think your mind is not strong enough to resist them, you should ignore ads and try to avoid them.


If you think you can't resist ads, just resist them!

If you think you might get tricked, just don't get tricked!

What a marvelous solution that absolutely fails to address the problem of consumers ending up paying for those million-dollar super bowl ads because the guy who puts his money into improving the product failed and the one who spent it all on ads is still in business.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 34405
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: The Libertarian Party needs change
Reply #38 - Aug 4th, 2018 at 9:06am
Print Post  
Jeff wrote on Aug 2nd, 2018 at 6:17pm:
I'm on tenterhooks awaiting your reply lizard... Smiley
I meant your reply to Andrew_Armao...
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 34405
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: The Libertarian Party needs change
Reply #39 - Aug 4th, 2018 at 9:14am
Print Post  
The Opposition wrote on Aug 4th, 2018 at 8:37am:
If you think you can't resist ads, just resist them!

If you think you might get tricked, just don't get tricked!

What a marvelous solution that absolutely fails to address the problem of consumers ending up paying for those million-dollar super bowl ads because the guy who puts his money into improving the product failed and the one who spent it all on ads is still in business.
Once again, you claim free markets and economic liberty must be abandoned because they don't work "perfectly".

I don't pay for those Superbowl ads because I don't buy any of the advertised products, nor do I watch the Superbowl.

Advertisers may or may not be correct in their estimations that money spent on advertising improves their bottom line, and companies that try to sell inferior products by means of slick advertising will eventually be discovered as selling inferior products.

In the meantime, advertising serves useful purposes in the market, for both sellers and buyers.

When Abe Lincoln hung a sign outside his office that said "Lawyer", he was advertising. It made it easier for him to get customers, and also made it easier for people wanting/needing the services of a lawyer to find him.

  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 ... 12
Send TopicPrint
 
Libertarian's ForumLibertarian's ForumFreedom Forum › The Libertarian Party needs change
Libertarian's Forum

Libertarian's Forum Information Rules, Agreement and Privacy Policy