Libertarian's Forum
Libertarian Forum to discuss politics and free market economics.
Libertarian's ForumLibertarian's ForumFreedom Forum › Cop Tases Eleven Year Old Shoplifter. NOT Caught on Body Cam.
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 ... 19 20 [21] 22 23 ... 32 Send TopicPrint
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Cop Tases Eleven Year Old Shoplifter. NOT Caught on Body Cam. (Read 2801 times)
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 36063
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Cop Tases Eleven Year Old Shoplifter. NOT Caught on Body Cam.
Reply #200 - Oct 5th, 2018 at 10:21am
Print Post  
Snarky Sack wrote on Oct 5th, 2018 at 8:40am:
It sure is.  If the judge was earning the money, there would be no reason to force people to pay it.
Judges work for what they are paid by providing a service that helps keep communities civilized and safe. People have decided to pay them with taxes.

I understand you think no government is legitimate because you claim people can't consent to have a government, and that no taxation can be authorized to provide any sort of government service because all taxes are theft.

That is narrow minded and shortsighted of you, and I really can't see how you can keep maintaining that government can be founded by donations.

You should get started with your project to talk people in some small town into abandoning taxation and funding their government through donations. It will be a first in the history of the world. You will become a famous hero of individual liberty. Smiley

  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 36063
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Cop Tases Eleven Year Old Shoplifter. NOT Caught on Body Cam.
Reply #201 - Oct 5th, 2018 at 10:30am
Print Post  
Snarky Sack wrote on Oct 5th, 2018 at 9:18am:
Do you include G. Washington among those progressives?  He "found" the right to tax farmers...
The power to tax was granted by the Constitution. Congress enacted the tax on whiskey (including the people's representatives in the House). Washington signed it.

It was legitimate to consider that the people refusing to pay the tax were in rebellion.

People in government, as you pointed out, are not somehow imbued with the wisdom of goods by being elected. They make mistakes, they do wrong things, they listen to bad advice, they misinterpret laws.

Anyway, when it came to government in it's essentials, Washington was not a progressive.

In the instance, he was the chief executive of a newly constituted government trying to pay it's debts and survive so it could do the job it was assigned, which was to protect the people of the new nation from foreign invasion and to preserve the blessings of liberty.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 36063
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Cop Tases Eleven Year Old Shoplifter. NOT Caught on Body Cam.
Reply #202 - Oct 5th, 2018 at 10:31am
Print Post  
Snarky Sack wrote on Oct 5th, 2018 at 9:18am:
Do you include G. Washington among those progressives?  He "found" the right to tax farmers who made small batch whiskey more than the large eastern manufacturers.  He also found the right to own his slaves. No need to put found in quotation marks, since the constitution is very specific about that right.
No government has rights. The power to tax is a granted power, not a right.

Why can't you ever get that right?
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Snarky Sack
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 4353
Location: Republic of Me
Joined: Sep 11th, 2017
Re: Cop Tases Eleven Year Old Shoplifter. NOT Caught on Body Cam.
Reply #203 - Oct 5th, 2018 at 10:32am
Print Post  
Jeff wrote on Oct 5th, 2018 at 10:21am:
Judges work for what they are paid by providing a service that helps keep communities civilized and safe. People have decided to pay them with taxes.




How does sending Bill Cosby, elderly and legally blind, to prison for the rest of his life based on a decades old allegation of one accuser followed by accusers from a movement that actually calls itself "#metoo" keep the community safe?
  

"I think I'll backtrack." - Jeff
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 36063
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Cop Tases Eleven Year Old Shoplifter. NOT Caught on Body Cam.
Reply #204 - Oct 5th, 2018 at 10:34am
Print Post  
Snarky Sack wrote on Oct 5th, 2018 at 9:21am:
Taxation is the foundation of nearly all governments' evildoing.
It is operating outside the law and exceeding their granted powers that created both the welfare/warfare state and the illegal distortion of the taxing power to remove it's legitimate limitations.

You might as well say that the existence of property causes people to steal.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Snarky Sack
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 4353
Location: Republic of Me
Joined: Sep 11th, 2017
Re: Cop Tases Eleven Year Old Shoplifter. NOT Caught on Body Cam.
Reply #205 - Oct 5th, 2018 at 11:02am
Print Post  
Jeff wrote on Oct 5th, 2018 at 10:34am:
It is operating outside the law and exceeding their granted powers that created both the welfare/warfare state and the illegal distortion of the taxing power to remove it's legitimate limitations.

You might as well say that the existence of property causes people to steal.


How do the people grant government the power to tax them in any way?  Just majority rules?
  

"I think I'll backtrack." - Jeff
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 36063
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Cop Tases Eleven Year Old Shoplifter. NOT Caught on Body Cam.
Reply #206 - Oct 5th, 2018 at 1:22pm
Print Post  
Snarky Sack wrote on Oct 5th, 2018 at 10:32am:
How does sending Bill Cosby, elderly and legally blind, to prison for the rest of his life based on a decades old allegation of one accuser followed by accusers from a movement that actually calls itself "#metoo" keep the community safe?
I'm not interested in talking about specific cases where the system of justice has been perverted and misused.

I'd rather talk about the people who are doing the abusing and misusing and creating a system where feelings are more important than facts.

They aren't libertarians.

If you want to toss out the entire system of law and justice (and I think you do) because some people are misusing it, I'll talk about that too, and how I believe you are terribly misguided.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 36063
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Cop Tases Eleven Year Old Shoplifter. NOT Caught on Body Cam.
Reply #207 - Oct 5th, 2018 at 1:26pm
Print Post  
Snarky Sack wrote on Oct 5th, 2018 at 11:02am:
How do the people grant government the power to tax them in any way?  Just majority rules?
The majority of the state legislatures ratified the Constitution, making it effective, including the granted power to tax.

State legislatures are composed of representatives elected by the majority of people voting. It's a form of republican government where for certain things, a majority or supermajority carries the day.

It's the best way known to enable large groups of diverse people to live together in peace and freedom.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Snarky Sack
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 4353
Location: Republic of Me
Joined: Sep 11th, 2017
Re: Cop Tases Eleven Year Old Shoplifter. NOT Caught on Body Cam.
Reply #208 - Oct 5th, 2018 at 2:38pm
Print Post  
Jeff wrote on Oct 5th, 2018 at 1:26pm:
The majority of the state legislatures ratified the Constitution, making it effective, including the granted power to tax.

State legislatures are composed of representatives elected by the majority of people voting. It's a form of republican government where for certain things, a majority or supermajority carries the day.

It's the best way known to enable large groups of diverse people to live together in peace and freedom.


Ok, so it is just “majority rules” but that phrase sticks in your craw?

So by your logic, if a majority of people elect a majority of representatives who say that Jeff’s must allow one room of his house to be used to house homeless people, there’s no violation of Jeff’s rights?

You and the homeless person will live together in peace and freedom?

  

"I think I'll backtrack." - Jeff
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
SkyChief
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 8037
Location: California Coast
Joined: Aug 18th, 2014
Re: Cop Tases Eleven Year Old Shoplifter. NOT Caught on Body Cam.
Reply #209 - Oct 5th, 2018 at 3:31pm
Print Post  
Snarky Sack wrote on Oct 5th, 2018 at 9:21am:
Taxation is the foundation of nearly all governments' evildoing. 

Ron Paul agrees:

"Income taxes are responsible for the transformation of the Federal government from one of limited powers into a vast leviathan whose tentacles reach into almost every aspect of American life."

  And John Marshall:

"The power to tax is the power to destroy."
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 ... 19 20 [21] 22 23 ... 32
Send TopicPrint
 
Libertarian's ForumLibertarian's ForumFreedom Forum › Cop Tases Eleven Year Old Shoplifter. NOT Caught on Body Cam.
Libertarian's Forum

Libertarian's Forum Information Rules, Agreement and Privacy Policy