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Andrew_Armao
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Political Agenda of the Libertarian Party
Sep 8th, 2018 at 4:16am
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For many years, I haven't seen major moves in the Libertarian party for candidates to get into office. They have only stood in the "middle" by their lonesome, with no umph behind ANYTHING they stand for.

Appearing, as being individuals that half-believe their own principles. It's hard for Libertarians to get elected when they believe against the positions in government they are "running" for, if you could call it that.

I am repulsed by the lack of enthusiasm in the party. We need energy in our party, we need enthusiasm. People should know what we stand for, and why they should stand for it. Not just for less government, but for the little we would support.

Some Libertarians I talk to wouldn't even know what to do if they got elected! What a shameful set of affairs. WE NEED STRENGTH. WE NEED INTELLECT. WE NEED LIBERTY.

America was built by Libertarians, I believe, to institute government that is minimal, and pragmatic. Seeing how for a people to exist, a power center must fill the void lest tyranny, fill its place; like the end of the Grecian age, where rulers of unregulated power devastated politics.

We must define what government we SHOULD have, not just what we are willing to annihilate; for a govenrnment constructed with the sole purpose of preventing the creation of a larger one which steals your rights was the objective, we must find what government and policies we would create to foster the environment for the lasting prolonging of those rights, while preventing the creation of Oligarchs and their pet Lobbyists, who would steal your Liberties through a government.

We cannot sit on our hands any longer, we must push the agenda, not to get people to agree lockstep, but to get them on our side for their jobs, for their wages, and for this Homeland that we call America.

Forever Liberty!
  

Andrew J Armao
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Jeff
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Re: Political Agenda of the Libertarian Party
Reply #1 - Sep 8th, 2018 at 9:27am
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Andrew_Armao wrote on Sep 8th, 2018 at 4:16am:
We must define what government we SHOULD have...
I've always thought that mainstream libertarians made that very clear.

But anyway, if you want to get specific about what government we should have, and why, go ahead, get started.

What's your first idea for something that government should do?

Edit: I'll start for you- We should have a government that protects the rights of all citizens (and others in the country) equally under the law. Here's an example of how that can be done using an institution of government to achieve that goal-

https://indefenseofliberty.blog/2018/09/06/no-senator-theyre-not-in-it-for-hot-d...


  
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Snarky Sack
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Re: Political Agenda of the Libertarian Party
Reply #2 - Sep 8th, 2018 at 9:44am
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Andrew_Armao wrote on Sep 8th, 2018 at 4:16am:
Appearing, as being individuals that half-believe their own principles. It's hard for Libertarians to get elected when they believe against the positions in government they are "running" for, if you could call it that.



Forever Liberty!


Good point.  Too many libertarians only pay attention to presidential and gubernatorial races and legislative slots.  We should also be focusing on positions that we don't think should even exist in a libertarian nation.  County tax assessors, State school boards, Water commisioners, and other positions that represent government over-reach can be targeted for staffing by ourselves and not people who think those positions are legitimate and, if anything, should be expanded.

I have often thought about running for Constable in my precinct.  Deputy constables are the worst law enforcement officers in my state and that's saying a lot.  They do almost nothing but write tickets to generate the revenue needed for their salaries and that of the magistrates and staff who adjudicate the tickets.  They never make the news for any arrest of a real criminal.  Yet, nearly every time the news is that "off-duty officer accidentally shoots _______ ," it almost always turns out to be a deputy constable.

So, why would I want to be the Constable?  To transform the department.  I would increase their existing contract neighborhood program and offer the same service to the mall in my precinct.  The Ticket writing program would end.  Constables would be trained in and held accountable for respecting the rights of civilians and not taking the shortcuts that police are notorious for.  Using the discretion available to any police officer or police leader, I would end arrests for "victimless crimes."

That's me.  Any libertarian can pick one area in which he or she could make a difference and go for it.

   


  

"I think I'll backtrack." - Jeff
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Jeff
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Re: Political Agenda of the Libertarian Party
Reply #3 - Sep 8th, 2018 at 10:03am
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Snarky Sack wrote on Sep 8th, 2018 at 9:44am:
Good point.  Too many libertarians only pay attention to presidential and gubernatorial races and legislative slots.  We should also be focusing on positions that we don't think should even exist in a libertarian nation.  County tax assessors, State school boards, Water commisioners, and other positions that represent government over-reach can be targeted for staffing by ourselves and not people who think those positions are legitimate and, if anything, should be expanded.

I have often thought about running for Constable in my precinct.  Deputy constables are the worst law enforcement officers in my state and that's saying a lot.  They do almost nothing but write tickets to generate the revenue needed for their salaries and that of the magistrates and staff who adjudicate the tickets.  They never make the news for any arrest of a real criminal.  Yet, nearly every time the news is that "off-duty officer accidentally shoots _______ ," it almost always turns out to be a deputy constable.

So, why would I want to be the Constable?  To transform the department.  I would increase their existing contract neighborhood program and offer the same service to the mall in my precinct.  The Ticket writing program would end.  Constables would be trained in and held accountable for respecting the rights of civilians and not taking the shortcuts that police are notorious for.  Using the discretion available to any police officer or police leader, I would end arrests for "victimless crimes."

That's me.  Any libertarian can pick one area in which he or she could make a difference and go for it.

   


Teddy Roosevelt was a reformer too.

I think you'd do better as a member of the council that hires, fires and controls the Constables. Try to convince others on the council that police unions and "qualified immunity" for police are at the root of the problems and that everyone would be better off if no one ever got a speeding ticket and that Constables should be allowed to selectively enforce the laws at their discretion.
  
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Re: Political Agenda of the Libertarian Party
Reply #4 - Sep 9th, 2018 at 12:17am
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Andrew_Armao wrote on Sep 8th, 2018 at 4:16am:
We must define what government we SHOULD have, not just what we are willing to annihilate


I see your point and I will raise you some cats.

If you can get even two people on this forum to agree about exactly which programmes the government ought to have, and which behaviours should and should not be allowed, I will herd cats.

Owning exotic animals, such as tigers, is aggression, apparently. This is because exotic animals are dangerous. And while domestic animals are also dangerous, the danger of a vicious dog is always due to a person having abused the dog. It is impossible for a dig to be naturally vicious.

You can't make this stuff up, folks.

RubyHypatia wrote on Jun 25th, 2018 at 5:41pm:
Opp, yes it does matter what a gun or a dog or a tiger is good for.  There's a reason tigers are outlawed as pets, while dogs are not.  And there's a reason we're allowed to own guns.  The benefit of owning a tiger isn't worth the risk.  There is no benefit to owning a tiger like there is to owning a dog or gun.


Jeff wrote on Jun 26th, 2018 at 7:23am:
The Opposition wrote on Jun 26th, 2018 at 12:18am:
I propose that dogs be limited to people who use them for those purposes, then, and banned to those who only want one for companionship.


Shame on you. You would deny a basic right... Isn't that your (absurdly wrong) complaint about libertarians, that they want to deny rights to others?


Jeff wrote on Jun 26th, 2018 at 3:19pm:
Some do Dork. If you treat [dogs] well and make them a part of your family, they will protect everyone in the family.

It's the one's that get abused and taught to be vicious that are the problem, and that goes back to the responsibility of the owners.


RubyHypatia wrote on Jun 26th, 2018 at 6:21pm:
Yep, it's the owners that make them vicious.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Andrew_Armao
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Re: Political Agenda of the Libertarian Party
Reply #5 - Sep 9th, 2018 at 3:48am
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Jeff wrote on Sep 8th, 2018 at 9:27am:
I've always thought that mainstream libertarians made that very clear.

But anyway, if you want to get specific about what government we should have, and why, go ahead, get started.

What's your first idea for something that government should do?

Edit: I'll start for you- We should have a government that protects the rights of all citizens (and others in the country) equally under the law. Here's an example of how that can be done using an institution of government to achieve that goal-

https://indefenseofliberty.blog/2018/09/06/no-senator-theyre-not-in-it-for-hot-d...




Ideas that come to mind is what amendments or programs must we create to prevent the creation of overreaching and expansions of government. (I do acknowledge that many breaches of the constitution have occured already)

What do we want the ideal government to look like. How many departments? I'm saying having a vision for people to see when passing by the party online, or else where. I want this party to succeed, in saying there's a branding issue.

This party can get to 15% of the vote without a problem, it just seems voters are most driven to vote when they feel they're getting something. I'm saying we need to be for an idea, WHILE we slash 90% of government, not just advertising the slashing.
  

Andrew J Armao
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Andrew_Armao
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Re: Political Agenda of the Libertarian Party
Reply #6 - Sep 9th, 2018 at 4:58am
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Snarky Sack wrote on Sep 8th, 2018 at 9:44am:
Good point.  Too many libertarians only pay attention to presidential and gubernatorial races and legislative slots.  We should also be focusing on positions that we don't think should even exist in a libertarian nation.  County tax assessors, State school boards, Water commisioners, and other positions that represent government over-reach can be targeted for staffing by ourselves and not people who think those positions are legitimate and, if anything, should be expanded.

I have often thought about running for Constable in my precinct.  Deputy constables are the worst law enforcement officers in my state and that's saying a lot.  They do almost nothing but write tickets to generate the revenue needed for their salaries and that of the magistrates and staff who adjudicate the tickets.  They never make the news for any arrest of a real criminal.  Yet, nearly every time the news is that "off-duty officer accidentally shoots _______ ," it almost always turns out to be a deputy constable.

So, why would I want to be the Constable?  To transform the department.  I would increase their existing contract neighborhood program and offer the same service to the mall in my precinct.  The Ticket writing program would end.  Constables would be trained in and held accountable for respecting the rights of civilians and not taking the shortcuts that police are notorious for.  Using the discretion available to any police officer or police leader, I would end arrests for "victimless crimes."

That's me.  Any libertarian can pick one area in which he or she could make a difference and go for it.

   




😂 I was talking of the members about us that think the concept of a Republic is too dubious, ones closer to anarchy. I was making the point, that these individuals dont even bother to run for office. I think people on the further side of our party are exceptionally important. We need people that are vigorously anti bloated government.
  

Andrew J Armao
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Jeff
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Re: Political Agenda of the Libertarian Party
Reply #7 - Sep 9th, 2018 at 9:17am
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Andrew_Armao wrote on Sep 9th, 2018 at 3:48am:
What do we want the ideal government to look like. How many departments?
Let's settle for the best possible government, because government will never be "ideal".

As for Departments, if it's not mentioned in the Constitution, it isn't authorized (and we've already almost sort of gotten rid of the Post Office Department.)

If we can get back to that, to having only the Departments mentioned in the Constitution, then we can debate at our leisure about getting rid of some of them too.

I've already repeatedly made my ideas about emending the Constitution known-

Repeal the 16th and 17th Amendments and clarify that there are no general powers granted by the Constitution, for instance, the commerce clause is not a general grant of power to control the economy and the mention of the general welfare in the Preamble is certainly not a grant of power for the government to do whatever it wants to as long as it claims it will be good for everyone in general.

Powers that will have good general effects are granted to Congress in Article I Section 8.

It seems necessary these days that it should also be made clear that all legislative power does indeed reside with Congress, and that "regulations" issued by bureaucracies can't have the force of law, nor can Presidents "Order" anyone but employees of the Executive Branch to do anything.

  
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Re: Political Agenda of the Libertarian Party
Reply #8 - Sep 9th, 2018 at 11:23am
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Andrew_Armao wrote on Sep 9th, 2018 at 3:48am:
Ideas that come to mind is what amendments or programs must we create to prevent the creation of overreaching and expansions of government. (I do acknowledge that many breaches of the constitution have occured already)


Libertarians want to abolish Income Tax.

We should start with repeal of the 16th Amendment which grants government the "power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment."

The 16th Amendment enabled the greatest government expansion phase the country had ever seen.

It enabled Wilson to get the US entangled in WW I - something he promised not to do during his re-election campaign.

"The power to tax is the power to destroy." John Marshall
  
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Re: Political Agenda of the Libertarian Party
Reply #9 - Sep 9th, 2018 at 1:28pm
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SkyChief wrote on Sep 9th, 2018 at 11:23am:
Libertarians want to abolish Income Tax.

We should start with repeal of the 16th Amendment which grants government the "power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment."

The 16th Amendment enabled the greatest government expansion phase the country had ever seen.

It enabled Wilson to get the US entangled in WW I - something he promised not to do during his re-election campaign.

"The power to tax is the power to destroy." John Marshall
Here's a good short exposition of the financing of WWI, including the earliest uses of the Income Tax.

https://www.encyclopedia.com/defense/energy-government-and-defense-magazines/fin...

"Progressives" to this day will think it was all well done.
  
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