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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Coming to My Town: Robot Brothels! (Read 302 times)
Snarky Sack
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Coming to My Town: Robot Brothels!
Sep 25th, 2018 at 9:19am
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The first so-called "robot sex brothel" in the U.S. slated to open in the Houston area this month has prompted a massive backlash from residents and activists who say it will ruin the neighborhood.

The company opened its first location last year near Toronto, where $60 buys a half-hour alone with a robot sex doll, according to the Washington Examiner. The dolls start at $2,500 to buy.

Yuval Gavriel, the founder of KinkySdollS, made the announcement during an interview with the Examiner last week, telling the paper he plans to expand to 10 locations throughout the United States by 2020.

Elijah Rising, a Houston-based non-profit organization aimed at ending sex trafficking, started a petition titled “Keep Robot Brothels Out Of Houston.” The non-profit has more than 6,500 signatures as of early Tuesday morning.

“As a nonprofit whose mission is to end sex trafficking we have seen the progression as sex buyers go from pornography to strip clubs to purchasing sex—robot brothels will ultimately harm men, their understanding of healthy sexuality, and increase the demand for the prostitution and sexual exploitation of women and children,” the petition states.

The organization plans to present the petition to city’s mayor, according to FOX 26 Houston.

Residents are also expressing their opposition to the brothel, which Gavriel described as a “showroom” where customers can test and rent dolls before deciding to purchase one.

"There's kids around here and it's a family-oriented neighborhood and I live right here and to have that here is just gross," Andrea Paul told KTRK.

City officials told KHOU 11 on Friday they have not heard of the business, and a spokesperson with the City of Houston's Public Works said they do not have an address for where it will be located. Fox News reached out to the mayor’s office early Tuesday and did not immediately get a response.

The business does not meet the definition of a sexually oriented business and requires simply an occupancy permit, ABC 7 News reported.


Despite concerns, there are no regulations for the sex robot business, the Examiner reported. Activists and legal experts call on legislative action.

"I can buy two or three or four of these on the Internet and in Washington, D.C., or New York, or anywhere I want, I can set them up and charge people $100 an hour to use them," John Banzhaf, a law professor at George Washington University, told the Examiner.


http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2018/09/25/countrys-first-robot-sex-brothel-set-to-o...

"Concerns."

That's all it takes for us to lose our rights.  Someone's being concerned.



  

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The Opposition
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Re: Coming to My Town: Robot Brothels!
Reply #1 - Sep 25th, 2018 at 9:33pm
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I want to know why you think you should get your brothel but I don't get my chicken. Everyone on this forum has agreed I have no right to own a chicken if it affects others.

Jeff wrote on Jul 4th, 2014 at 8:37am:
I raise chickens. If you want to buy one, I'll sell it to you. If you steal one, I'll file a complaint and have you arrested.
I don't raise my chickens in a residential neighborhood. If I did, they would constitute a nuisance and possibly a health hazard, and my neighbors would file complaints against me.


RubyHypatia wrote on Jun 25th, 2018 at 5:41pm:
Opp, yes it does matter what a gun or a dog or a tiger is good for.  There's a reason tigers are outlawed as pets, while dogs are not.  And there's a reason we're allowed to own guns.  The benefit of owning a tiger isn't worth the risk.  There is no benefit to owning a tiger like there is to owning a dog or gun.


SkyChief wrote on Dec 1st, 2017 at 1:26pm:
The reason(s) for owning a gun is quite different than the reason to own a tiger or a chicken.   I'm saddened to be labeled a rabid, selfish, maniac.

There is only one absolute right that each and every person on the planet has:   self-defense.    All living things have a right to self-defense.  Tigers have it - even chickens have it.  (If you've ever witnessed a cockfight, you have seen self-defense of chickens)

If government were to ban guns, it would take away our means of self-defense, and that would be immoral.   If government were to ban (ownership of) tigers, no rights were violated - it is not immoral.

Libertarianism is based on self-ownership of the individual. It means a person's wealth and property belongs to him/her  -  not the government.

You accept some degree of risk getting out of bed.  A little more risk once you leave the house. Risk goes up considerably when you drive your car.   Life is full of risks.  Don't worry if I'm carrying my gun.  If you don't physically attack me, I promise not to shoot (at) you.   Scout's honor.


Here's another gaping hole in the NAP libertarians love to wallow in: Risk.

If I risk you, it's aggression; I have no right to do it.

But if you risk me, you have a good reason and I shouldn't dare think of violating your rights.

By the way, I proved in the other thread that there are less deaths of others per tiger owned than per gun owned.

https://pethelpful.com/exotic-pets/big-cat-attacks-USA

Many of the statistics people often quote about big cat attacks are fudged because they include zoos and incidences that happen outside the US. I compared deaths per pet tiger owned, to deaths per gun owned. Tigers are somewhat safer. But it doesn't matter, because, you see, it matters why you want it.

I get no extra freedoms under libertarianism. Every freedom I might want that libertarianism offers is easily nuked by a pro interpretation of the NAP, while protecting libertarians like a magic cloak.

It supports my contention that libertarians know their system of rights is too expansive for everyone to have those rights in practice.

I have every reason to think that under libertarianism, I will lose access to roads, have to endure massive drops in property value thanks to robot brothels occupying my neighbourhood, and my cat will be taken away. After all, a cat has no practical benefit, like a dog does. Prove me wrong.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
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Re: Coming to My Town: Robot Brothels!
Reply #2 - Sep 26th, 2018 at 12:22pm
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The Opposition wrote on Sep 25th, 2018 at 9:33pm:
I get no extra freedoms under libertarianism. Every freedom I might want that libertarianism offers is easily nuked by a pro interpretation of the NAP, while protecting libertarians like a magic cloak.

The essential freedom that libertarianism offers is self-ownership.  Any other perceived libertarian freedoms are a derived from self-ownership. 

Self-ownership is unique to libertarianism - no other political ideology embraces it.

NAP is perfectly compatible with self-ownership.


The Opposition wrote on Sep 25th, 2018 at 9:33pm:
I have every reason to think that under libertarianism, I will lose access to roads, have to endure massive drops in property value thanks to robot brothels occupying my neighbourhood, and my cat will be taken away. After all, a cat has no practical benefit, like a dog does.

You wont lose access to roads.  There might be a toll on private roads.

Robot brothels must be compliant with local zoning laws.  If you do not want robot brothels in your neighborhood, go to City Hall with a petition signed by your neighbors stating so.

Demand that when anyone requests a zoning variance in order to establish a robot brothel (all zoning variances must be authorized by City Council), neighbors have the right (and opportunity) to voice opposition to the zoning variance.
  
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Snarky Sack
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Re: Coming to My Town: Robot Brothels!
Reply #3 - Sep 26th, 2018 at 2:41pm
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The Opposition wrote on Sep 25th, 2018 at 9:33pm:
I want to know why you think you should get your brothel but I don't get my chicken. Everyone on this forum has agreed I have no right to own a chicken if it affects others.



Not me, I hope you enjoy your chickens more than the Colonel.

Quote:
Here's another gaping hole in the NAP libertarians love to wallow in: Risk.

If I risk you, it's aggression; I have no right to do it.

But if you risk me, you have a good reason and I shouldn't dare think of violating your rights.

By the way, I proved in the other thread that there are less deaths of others per tiger owned than per gun owned.

https://pethelpful.com/exotic-pets/big-cat-attacks-USA

Many of the statistics people often quote about big cat attacks are fudged because they include zoos and incidences that happen outside the US. I compared deaths per pet tiger owned, to deaths per gun owned. Tigers are somewhat safer. But it doesn't matter, because, you see, it matters why you want it.

I get no extra freedoms under libertarianism. Every freedom I might want that libertarianism offers is easily nuked by a pro interpretation of the NAP, while protecting libertarians like a magic cloak.

It supports my contention that libertarians know their system of rights is too expansive for everyone to have those rights in practice.

I have every reason to think that under libertarianism, I will lose access to roads, have to endure massive drops in property value thanks to robot brothels occupying my neighbourhood, and my cat will be taken away. After all, a cat has no practical benefit, like a dog does. Prove me wrong.


Any attempt to take your property or forbid you from having it is aggression.  If whatever animal a non-libertarian fears actually gets out and hurts someone, like that skunk or whatever that bit Jeff's daughter, that's the time to take appropriate action.

What some people can't let go of is that in a libertarian system, sometimes the appropriate action is to just do nothing.  A simple cost benefit analysis will tell you that.  So you get bit by a critter.  Take yourself to the doctor for testing and shots if needed before you start dreaming of revenge on an animal which would not have bitten except in a misguided attempt at natural self-defense.

If you can put the animal to sleep without a lot of effort, fine.  But if it requires the SWAT team to shoot at your neighbor from helicopters, that's out of proportion to the benefit.



  

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Re: Coming to My Town: Robot Brothels!
Reply #4 - Sep 26th, 2018 at 5:28pm
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Snarky Sack wrote on Sep 25th, 2018 at 9:19am:
That's all it takes for us to lose our rights.  Someone's being concerned.



Buy one of your own, you have a right to do that. Or find someplace to live that thinks AI robot brothels are a great idea...

I heard that prisoners in Norway, as well as being given guitars, are now going to be provided with the AI robot sex doll of their choice, any age, any sex, any color.

Probably to best protect your rights to having sex with AI robots, you should go to Norway and kill someone.
  
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Re: Coming to My Town: Robot Brothels!
Reply #5 - Sep 26th, 2018 at 8:44pm
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Jeff wrote on Sep 26th, 2018 at 5:28pm:
Buy one of your own, you have a right to do that. Or find someplace to live that thinks AI robot brothels are a great idea...




So my right to operate a robot brothel or to patronize one - depends entirely on someone else thinking it's a good idea?

Are you SURE your libertarian?

You sound pretty fascist to me . . .

EDIT:

Also, read how you put that. I have to find "someplace that thinks" something is a good idea in order to have a right to do it.  Places don't think, people think. 

You have this mystical, tribalistic idea that there are geographic areas in which the "will of the people" is manifest and that will, expressed through some political process, has the ability to grant or deny rights to individuals.  That's not factual.  What happens is that some individuals gain influence over the process of government and use that influence to their own advantage.

Libertarianism, by taking force out of the equation, makes that process more problematic for the would-be influence users to take advantage of the system.

No freeloading is possible in a system in which people are not forced to pay for programs on which others may freeload.


« Last Edit: Sep 27th, 2018 at 7:52am by Snarky Sack »  

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Re: Coming to My Town: Robot Brothels!
Reply #6 - Sep 27th, 2018 at 7:55am
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Snarky Sack wrote on Sep 26th, 2018 at 8:44pm:
So my right to operate a robot brothel or to patronize one - depends entirely on someone else thinking it's a good idea?
That's just how communities operating under representative democracies work Red. Sometimes they have laws made that restrict liberty because they think it will make for a better community. It's a "progressive" impulse to make people/society better through government action.

It's unfortunate that we don't live in a completely libertarian country, but we don't and there isn't one.

You have the option of working to change the law to allow AI robot brothels where you live, or of moving someplace where they are allowed.

What exactly did I say that you think makes me sound like a fascist?

A fascist would likely advocate for having AI robot brothels everywhere, operated as crony businesses in partnership with the government, or maybe as a fee-for-service branch of the Dept. of Health and Welfare...
  
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Jeff
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Re: Coming to My Town: Robot Brothels!
Reply #7 - Sep 27th, 2018 at 7:58am
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Snarky Sack wrote on Sep 26th, 2018 at 8:44pm:
EDIT:

Also, read how you put that. I have to find "someplace that thinks" something is a good idea in order to have a right to do it.  Places don't think, people think. 
Right. That was poorly worded. I left out people.

Move somewhere that people think AI sex robots are a good idea.
  
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Re: Coming to My Town: Robot Brothels!
Reply #8 - Sep 27th, 2018 at 8:12am
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Snarky Sack wrote on Sep 26th, 2018 at 8:44pm:
You have this mystical, tribalistic idea that there are geographic areas in which the "will of the people" is manifest and that will, expressed through some political process, has the ability to grant or deny rights to individuals.
It's just the reality of having a system where state and local governments retain police powers, the power to make laws that prohibit certain activities that people in the state or locality generally think are wrong.

It's not a perfect system, just better than anything else that's known, and yes, rights are sometimes violated in the process. It is simply impossible to live in a community and have perfect liberty.

I suppose you think making AI robot brothels illegal violates your fundamental rights as well as the rights of those who would like to open AI brothels for business, and that theories of general liberty should guarantee that there are no restrictions at all placed on selling sex of any sort that people might be willing to pay for, and I agree in general, but I think there are much more serious restrictions being placed on our fundamental liberties than making brothels illegal, and that free sex as a first principle of libertarian campaigning is a very bad idea.
  
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Re: Coming to My Town: Robot Brothels!
Reply #9 - Sep 27th, 2018 at 9:02am
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Jeff wrote on Sep 27th, 2018 at 8:12am:
It's just the reality of having a system where state and local governments retain police powers, the power to make laws that prohibit certain activities that people in the state or locality generally think are wrong.

It's not a perfect system, just better than anything else that's known, and yes, rights are sometimes violated in the process. It is simply impossible to live in a community and have perfect liberty.

I suppose you think making AI robot brothels illegal violates your fundamental rights as well as the rights of those who would like to open AI brothels for business, and that theories of general liberty should guarantee that there are no restrictions at all placed on selling sex of any sort that people might be willing to pay for, and I agree in general, but I think there are much more serious restrictions being placed on our fundamental liberties than making brothels illegal, and that free sex as a first principle of libertarian campaigning is a very bad idea.


Actually, I think that standing up for robot brothels is a great place for the LP and libertarians in general to make a stand.

Robot brothels have never been regulated because it has only been a few years since they have been possible.* There is no law that I am aware of preventing them or requiring any specific licensing of them. 

So, the burden is on the anti-freedom movement to show why they should be illegal.  So far their arguments have been dead wrong.  The claim is that a robot brothel will lead customers to have the idea that buying sex is ok which will lead to buying sex from presumably human trafficed real people.  The obvious counter argument is that everytime a man rents a sex robot, he does not rent a human sex partner.

*Actually the "robots" are more dolls than robots. The idea of a brothel that features dolls instead of humans was used in a seventies or eighties Dirty Harry movie so it isn't such a recent idea. The difference is that the Dirty Harry love doll brothel featured inflatable toys that would be cheaper to buy than the rental cost.  Renting an item for fifty dollars instead of paying two thousand dollars to own one is a frequently used business model that benefits both parties and certainly harms no one in the case of "robot brothels."
  

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