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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) How Long will Kaz Last this Time? Join the Pool! (Read 549 times)
Little Big Man
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Re: How Long will Kaz Last this Time? Join the Pool!
Reply #40 - Jan 11th, 2019 at 7:53am
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Snarky Sack wrote yesterday at 9:34pm:
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All that is completely inevitable once you take paying for schools out of the hands of parents and give that responsibility to the taxpayer.


Jeff wrote on Jan 11th, 2019 at 7:16am:
You mean to say that parents of children in local schools have driven the creation of federal mandates for teaching and testing?


Actually, I said the opposite, as the part I bolded indicates.

Quote:
As I mentioned, I attended public schools (in two different states) in the '50s and '60s. What was taught and how it was taught and how students were evaluated were in the hands of parents, teachers and local administrators. It was cost effective and worked well.


It was in the hands of the school board and the voters who elected them.  Some of those voters were parents and some were not. 

Quote:
It was the federal mandates that took the decisions about local public schools out of the hands of parents and teachers and local administrators. It was a cooperative effort between the local parents, local teachers and local administrators that decided how to spend local tax money.


Those federal mandaters were elected by taxpayers, just as the local controllers were.  You are an advocate of a representative republic form of government under a constitution that grants supremacy to the national government over state governments and this is what it gets you. 

Any parent has the power to control their child's education as long as they can afford to send the to private school.  The fact that they cannot because they are taxed so much to pay for government school is the completely foreseeable result of the decision to tax people to pay for government schools. 

When government runs something - anything - it will be guided by influence peddling, not logic and altruism.  You  made this bed, so stop complaining about being short-sheeted.

  

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kaz
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Re: How Long will Kaz Last this Time? Join the Pool!
Reply #41 - Jan 11th, 2019 at 7:57am
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Little Big Man wrote on Jan 6th, 2019 at 6:35pm:
Anyone who wants to participate can post on this thread their prediction for Kaz' rage post in which he quits the board, "for good."

I'll post my prediction after some of you have had a chance.  I hate when I post something and it is so obviously correct that it ends the conversation.

Winner gets to put "I predicted Kaz' meltdown" in their sig.

EDIT:  What we are predicting is the date and time of Kaz' "final" post.  Sorry, that was clear in my head, but I didn't write it down.





I'll go with Friday, 1/18 at 7:45 am.


  

Contest winner:  I predicted Kaz' meltdown
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Jeff
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Re: How Long will Kaz Last this Time? Join the Pool!
Reply #42 - Jan 11th, 2019 at 8:10am
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kaz wrote on Jan 11th, 2019 at 7:57am:
I'll go with Friday, 1/18 at 7:45 am.


Do the rules allow you to participate in the pool?
  
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Jeff
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Re: How Long will Kaz Last this Time? Join the Pool!
Reply #43 - Jan 11th, 2019 at 8:15am
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Little Big Man wrote on Jan 11th, 2019 at 7:53am:
It was in the hands of the school board and the voters who elected them.  Some of those voters were parents and some were not. 



That's true. The governance of the schools was accomplished by a consensus between parents with kids in the school, teachers who taught there, administrators of the school and the elected school board. Non-parents participated in electing the school board and electing the local government that did the taxing. It's a recipe for good governance.
  
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Jeff
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Re: How Long will Kaz Last this Time? Join the Pool!
Reply #44 - Jan 11th, 2019 at 8:23am
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Little Big Man wrote on Jan 11th, 2019 at 7:53am:



Those federal mandaters were elected by taxpayers, just as the local controllers were.  You are an advocate of a representative republic form of government under a constitution that grants supremacy to the national government over state governments and this is what it gets you. 
In general, the federal mandates are designed and enforced by un-elected bureaucrats at the Dept. of Education. Laws passed by Congress that say "figure out a way to leave no child behind" get sent to the bureaucrats who are tasked with deciding how to accomplish the vague goal of the law.

Any power over education is a power reserved to the states, since the Constitution does not grant any power to the federal government related to education.

The federal government is granted power to require that state and local governments treat people equally under the laws (no discriminating by governments is allowed!), which gives them the authority to strike down laws that treat people differently.

As usual, you misunderstand a federal system of government with divided powers and divided responsibilities.
  
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kaz
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Re: How Long will Kaz Last this Time? Join the Pool!
Reply #45 - Jan 11th, 2019 at 8:55am
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Jeff wrote on Jan 11th, 2019 at 8:10am:
Do the rules allow you to participate in the pool?


That's a philosophical question of my views about Mosaic law too?
  

Contest winner:  I predicted Kaz' meltdown
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Little Big Man
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Re: How Long will Kaz Last this Time? Join the Pool!
Reply #46 - Jan 11th, 2019 at 11:05am
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Jeff wrote on Jan 11th, 2019 at 8:15am:
That's true. The governance of the schools was accomplished by a consensus between parents with kids in the school, teachers who taught there, administrators of the school and the elected school board. Non-parents participated in electing the school board and electing the local government that did the taxing. It's a recipe for good governance.


The consensus process you speak of may have happened in the early days of public school.  But, as with any tax-funded program, it came to be ultimately run by the people with the most influence over lawmakers. 
  

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Little Big Man
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Re: How Long will Kaz Last this Time? Join the Pool!
Reply #47 - Jan 11th, 2019 at 11:11am
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Jeff wrote on Jan 11th, 2019 at 8:23am:
Any power over education is a power reserved to the states, since the Constitution does not grant any power to the federal government related to education.




Well done!

I made that very point to when you claimed that the federal government had power over South Carolina's harbors.  When I asked you what part of the U.S. Constitution states that, you said:

Jeff wrote on Jan 10th, 2019 at 7:38pm:
It's one of those things that governments do...


So, which is it?  Is the federal government empowered to do only what the Constitution specifies or is it also empowered to do "those things that governments do."

If it is the latter, then the Constitution should have been much simpler.  It need only have said,

The federal government will do those things that governments do.
  

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Jeff
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Re: How Long will Kaz Last this Time? Join the Pool!
Reply #48 - Jan 11th, 2019 at 4:22pm
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kaz wrote on Jan 11th, 2019 at 8:55am:
That's a philosophical question of my views about Mosaic law too?
?
  
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Jeff
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Re: How Long will Kaz Last this Time? Join the Pool!
Reply #49 - Jan 11th, 2019 at 4:25pm
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Little Big Man wrote on Jan 11th, 2019 at 11:05am:
The consensus process you speak of may have happened in the early days of public school.  But, as with any tax-funded program, it came to be ultimately run by the people with the most influence over lawmakers. 
Teachers unions, the state Dept. of edu bureaucrats and the federal Dept. of edu bureaucrats.

That's what's wrong, but how it is funded is not the problem. The Dept. of edu was not created or established by the people who must fund it and are required to bow to it's mandates. Cry
  
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