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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) California Fines ghirardelli chocolate makers (Read 1132 times)
The Opposition
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Re: California Fines ghirardelli chocolate makers
Reply #40 - Feb 8th, 2019 at 10:54am
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Jeff wrote on Feb 7th, 2019 at 1:18pm:
That's often the problem, that somebody promises to give you something in return for what you give them, and then they don't. There are all sorts of ways to cheat people and steal from them. Fraud is one. It's a crime because it's theft.


Not all cheating is stealing. Stealing involves force. Fraud does not.

When you take someone's property without permission, you are using force on that property.

When someone puts that property in your hand, giving it to you voluntarily, there is no force.

That's why the NAP defines aggression as force or fraud. Fraud is not force. Because theft is force, fraud is not theft.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Jeff
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Re: California Fines ghirardelli chocolate makers
Reply #41 - Feb 8th, 2019 at 1:06pm
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The Opposition wrote on Feb 8th, 2019 at 10:54am:
Stealing involves force.

Force is not a necessary element of theft. Stealing sometimes involves force, but sometimes it does not.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/theft
  

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Re: California Fines ghirardelli chocolate makers
Reply #42 - Feb 8th, 2019 at 3:11pm
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Fraud is theft by deception, but it is theft none the less.
  
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Jeff
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Re: California Fines ghirardelli chocolate makers
Reply #43 - Feb 8th, 2019 at 4:30pm
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ahhell wrote on Feb 8th, 2019 at 3:11pm:
Fraud is theft by deception, but it is theft none the less. 
Do you think the California decision is correct, that they should be fined for spending more money on packaging to protect their product because some entitled person thought it was going be a solid piece of chocolate the size of the bag? Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
  

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Jeff
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Re: California Fines ghirardelli chocolate makers
Reply #44 - Feb 8th, 2019 at 4:32pm
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kaz wrote on Feb 5th, 2019 at 4:47pm:
As for me, as long as their labeling is accurate I'm good.  If they say 2 oz of chocolate, it's not on them to explain what a standard weight and measure is
They are required by law to use them though. Smiley
  

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ahhell
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Re: California Fines ghirardelli chocolate makers
Reply #45 - Feb 8th, 2019 at 4:35pm
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Jeff wrote on Feb 8th, 2019 at 4:30pm:
Do you think the California decision is correct, that they should be fined for spending more money on packaging to protect their product because some entitled person thought it was going be a solid piece of chocolate the size of the bag? Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
No, it was stupid, as long as the package contained the amount of chocolate stated on the package.

I do think there is a place for government in establishing(codifying really) standard weights and measures as well. 
  
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Jeff
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Re: California Fines ghirardelli chocolate makers
Reply #46 - Feb 8th, 2019 at 4:41pm
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kaz wrote on Feb 6th, 2019 at 5:16pm:
Agreed.  I don't have a legal issue with companies that sell a third of a box of cereal if the volume is listed correctly on the box.
It's sold by weight, not volume. There is a very good reason for that, and it's not trying to cheat, but, if I opened a box of cereal that was only 1/3 full, I would weigh the contents immediately so I could tell the store manager exactly how much I'd been shorted.

What brand of cereal did you buy that was only 1/3 full?
  

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Jeff
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Re: California Fines ghirardelli chocolate makers
Reply #47 - Feb 8th, 2019 at 4:45pm
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ahhell wrote on Feb 8th, 2019 at 4:35pm:
No, it was stupid, as long as the package contained the amount of chocolate stated on the package.

I do think there is a place for government in establishing(codifying really) standard weights and measures as well. 
I thought everything looked good for ditching English weights and measures back when I was in grade school in the early 60s or so.

Alas, they are still around! It's part of the plotting of Marxists to destroy capitalism by destroying America. Every little bit helps. Good socialists will take independent action to further the cause. Sometimes that gets them shot, but maybe not so much lately...
  

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The Opposition
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Re: California Fines ghirardelli chocolate makers
Reply #48 - Feb 8th, 2019 at 9:26pm
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Jeff wrote on Feb 8th, 2019 at 1:06pm:
Force is not a necessary element of theft. Stealing sometimes involves force, but sometimes it does not.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/theft


All stealing involves force. When you steal, you exert force against someone else's property.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Jeff
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Re: California Fines ghirardelli chocolate makers
Reply #49 - Feb 9th, 2019 at 8:06am
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The Opposition wrote on Feb 8th, 2019 at 9:26pm:
All stealing involves force. When you steal, you exert force against someone else's property.
That's an unusual way to say it, but it's great that you finally recognize that fraud is theft. Smiley
  

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