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Little Big Man
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Re: Would this be theft????? Hypothetical Scenario
Reply #50 - Feb 7th, 2019 at 9:31am
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Little Big Man wrote yesterday at 8:50pm:
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If both the store and the buyer had agreed with a wink that, "I didn't see the clock strike midnight because I wasn't looking that way," no one lost.  Since the store owner did not agree to that arrangement, he lost his right to refuse service to anyone for any reason.



Jeff wrote on Feb 7th, 2019 at 6:37am:
You're changing scenarios in midstream again.

You got your beer, the guy behind you didn't because it had passed midnight and beer sales were no longer legal. It wasn't a matter of anybody having a right to refuse service, it was the law saying "Too late".



He had the right to refuse service in order to comply with that law with that law that said "too late."  If he had chosen not to comply with that law, it would not have been theft.

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The man behind you lost the opportunity to legally buy beer that night, but no theft occurred. I don't much like the law, I think it's foolish, but nothing about this scenario involves theft either.


In reality, he did not steal the beer because he did not put the money on the counter and walk out with the beer.  If he had taken the beer, that would have been theft, because the person from whom he wanted to buy the beer said no.


  

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The Opposition
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Re: Would this be theft????? Hypothetical Scenario
Reply #51 - Feb 7th, 2019 at 10:35am
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Jeff wrote on Feb 7th, 2019 at 6:39am:
"Something besides money could have been taken" doesn't constitute theft.


So only money can be stolen? Not art or barrels or anything else?
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Jeff
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Re: Would this be theft????? Hypothetical Scenario
Reply #52 - Feb 7th, 2019 at 1:07pm
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Little Big Man wrote on Feb 7th, 2019 at 9:31am:
He had the right to refuse service in order to comply with that law with that law that said "too late."  If he had chosen not to comply with that law, it would not have been theft.
The law prohibited the sale. That has nothing to do with refusing or not refusing service. No theft was involved. The man the law prevented from buying the beer didn't pay for anything, he just left with his money instead of with beer. Refusing service is not theft either.
  

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Re: Would this be theft????? Hypothetical Scenario
Reply #53 - Feb 7th, 2019 at 1:11pm
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The Opposition wrote on Feb 7th, 2019 at 10:35am:
So only money can be stolen? Not art or barrels or anything else?
No no, the barmaid could have put her family heirloom dollar bill,  that her Grampa gave to her, into the tips jar, the one that had great sentimental value to her...

Art and barrels can be stolen too... Do you think there was a barrel in the tips jar?
  

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Re: Would this be theft????? Hypothetical Scenario
Reply #54 - Feb 7th, 2019 at 5:45pm
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Jeff wrote on Feb 7th, 2019 at 1:11pm:
No no, the barmaid could have put her family heirloom dollar bill,  that her Grampa gave to her, into the tips jar, the one that had great sentimental value to her...

Art and barrels can be stolen too... Do you think there was a barrel in the tips jar?


More realistically, she could have her first lucky tip from her first shift at the bottom of the jar for good luck.  Does she really have to explain that to everyone passing by or not have property rights to that dollar bill?

Or maybe she just doesn’t like people making change without asking her for no reason other than it seems creepy. 
  

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Jeff
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Re: Would this be theft????? Hypothetical Scenario
Reply #55 - Feb 7th, 2019 at 9:13pm
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Little Big Man wrote on Feb 7th, 2019 at 5:45pm:
Or maybe she just doesn’t like people making change without asking her for no reason other than it seems creepy. 
Yes, that's it.

Ask first. Kiss Kiss Kiss
  

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The Opposition
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Re: Would this be theft????? Hypothetical Scenario
Reply #56 - Feb 7th, 2019 at 9:19pm
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Jeff wrote on Feb 7th, 2019 at 1:11pm:
No no, the barmaid could have put her family heirloom dollar bill,  that her Grampa gave to her, into the tips jar, the one that had great sentimental value to her...

Art and barrels can be stolen too... Do you think there was a barrel in the tips jar?


I'm just trying to establish a principle.

I understand that no one wrote on the dollar, "This dollar's name is Bill. I love him; please don't take him." and then put a smiley face.

I'm asking if you acknowledge that if that was part of the scenario, something besides money could have been taken.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
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Re: Would this be theft????? Hypothetical Scenario
Reply #57 - Feb 7th, 2019 at 9:24pm
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The Opposition wrote on Feb 7th, 2019 at 9:19pm:
I'm just trying to establish a principle.

You seem to be failing.

Not my problem. Don't blame me.
  

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Re: Would this be theft????? Hypothetical Scenario
Reply #58 - Feb 7th, 2019 at 9:26pm
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The Opposition wrote on Feb 7th, 2019 at 9:19pm:
I'm asking if you acknowledge that if that was part of the scenario, something besides money could have been taken.
Sure, what do you claim was taken?
  

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The Opposition
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Re: Would this be theft????? Hypothetical Scenario
Reply #59 - Feb 7th, 2019 at 9:27pm
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Jeff wrote on Feb 7th, 2019 at 9:26pm:
Sure, what do you claim was taken?


If something else besides money was taken, it's theft, riiiight?
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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