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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Mousetraps Work because . . . (Read 1689 times)
Little Big Man
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Mousetraps Work because . . .
Feb 5th, 2019 at 8:30pm
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. . . mice don't understand that there's no such thing as free cheese.

I wish some of our own board members were as smart as mice.
  

Snarky no more!
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SkyChief
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Re: Mousetraps Work because . . .
Reply #1 - Feb 6th, 2019 at 12:52am
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I'm one of the smarter mouses meeces mice.

  

Governments will always devise ways to deprive an honest man of his money or property, and claim that it's legal.
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The Opposition
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Re: Mousetraps Work because . . .
Reply #2 - Feb 6th, 2019 at 1:10am
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This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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kaz
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Re: Mousetraps Work because . . .
Reply #3 - Feb 6th, 2019 at 6:27am
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Little Big Man wrote on Feb 5th, 2019 at 8:30pm:
. . . mice don't understand that there's no such thing as free cheese.

I wish some of our own board members were as smart as mice.


I'm against taxes because taxes are taxes stealing and stealing is taxes I hate stealing taxes and taxing stealing and stealing is stealing when taxes are tax stealing!

Trollin, trollin trollin.  Trollin, trollin trollin along!
  

Contest winner:  I predicted Kaz' meltdown
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The Opposition
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Re: Mousetraps Work because . . .
Reply #4 - Feb 6th, 2019 at 10:59am
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kaz wrote on Feb 6th, 2019 at 6:27am:
I'm against taxes because taxes are taxes stealing and stealing is taxes I hate stealing taxes and taxing stealing and stealing is stealing when taxes are tax stealing!

Trollin, trollin trollin.  Trollin, trollin trollin along!


I don't see how it's trolling. I have yet to see someone justify taxes as moral without resorting to insults.

If I take something involuntarily, it's theft.

If there are six of me doing this, I'm a gang. Still theft.

If there are a million of me doing this, and I say to the rest, "Hey guys let's have a vote to legitimise this action," and they all cheer and nod, and the few people I'm stealing from are outvoted, and I write a nice constitution to justify my actions, then I'm a government and it's not theft.

See where Burnsy and me get tripped up? The last just seems like a jazzed-up version of the second.

If you want me to change my opinion, I'll be more than glad to, since I don't want to live in Somalia either, but I need a consistent argument that wins, and it can't have insults in it since I'm not as good as you are at using insults.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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kaz
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Re: Mousetraps Work because . . .
Reply #5 - Feb 6th, 2019 at 4:59pm
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The Opposition wrote on Feb 6th, 2019 at 10:59am:
I don't see how it's trolling. I have yet to see someone justify taxes as moral without resorting to insults


Actually you have.  Consent of the governed.  Yes, life is gray.  You want it to be black and white.  But my view of God is he wants you to get off your ass and deal with life being black and white.  Not having taxes means living your entire life within a half hour of where you are born, sitting in a tower all day with a gun protecting your land, or just being conquered by a foreign power (Russia or China) and enslaved in a Communist system.

There is zero admirable about clinging to ideological purity at the expense of living your life and dealing with its complexity.  We're better off now than we would be with zero taxes.  Anarchy has no more liberty than Marxism, even if we weren't conquered.  You'd have to just make voluntary agreements with every citizen out there, which would never happen.

But you don't like that answer.  But that doesn't change that you've heard it over and over.  A large part of why I just insult you at this point.  You don't have to like my answers.  But process them and reply.  Don't just keep clinging to crap purity that if adopted would have no purity about it at all
  

Contest winner:  I predicted Kaz' meltdown
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Jeff
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Re: Mousetraps Work because . . .
Reply #6 - Feb 6th, 2019 at 5:32pm
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Little Big Man wrote on Feb 5th, 2019 at 8:30pm:
. . . mice don't understand that there's no such thing as free cheese.
Sure there is, to a mouse. Any cheese they eat without getting caught is free, and tasty too I think! Grin
  

"Free hate speech"
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Little Big Man
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Re: Mousetraps Work because . . .
Reply #7 - Feb 6th, 2019 at 8:53pm
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Jeff wrote on Feb 6th, 2019 at 5:32pm:
Sure there is, to a mouse. Any cheese they eat without getting caught is free, and tasty too I think! Grin


You got me with that one.

I once saw a poster in Frankfurt Germany which depicted a cartoon mouse sweating while trying to retrieve a piece of cheese from a mousetrap with a pencil.  I thought, 'Yep, that's what life is like.'
  

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Little Big Man
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Re: Mousetraps Work because . . .
Reply #8 - Feb 6th, 2019 at 8:55pm
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kaz wrote on Feb 6th, 2019 at 4:59pm:
Actually you have.  Consent of the governed.  Yes, life is gray.  You want it to be black and white.  But my view of God is he wants you to get off your ass and deal with life being black and white.  Not having taxes means living your entire life within a half hour of where you are born, sitting in a tower all day with a gun protecting your land, or just being conquered by a foreign power (Russia or China) and enslaved in a Communist system.

There is zero admirable about clinging to ideological purity at the expense of living your life and dealing with its complexity.  We're better off now than we would be with zero taxes.  Anarchy has no more liberty than Marxism, even if we weren't conquered.  You'd have to just make voluntary agreements with every citizen out there, which would never happen.

But you don't like that answer. 


I love that answer, Kaz, disagree or no.  There's hope for you yet, sir!

If you talked like that even one half of the time, you would be a respected member of this forum.

EDIT:

Hell, try it, Kaz.  I have about four more days of being mr. nice guy until the poll closes.  See if you can do the same for only four days.

I've tried not to watch the returns so I can be surprised at the results.  I agreed to follow the will of the voters so if I go back being the Snarkmeister, you can either follow my lead or be the bigger man, which I will have to admit if I'm the one being Snarky.  If the voters vote the nice ticket, then there will be two less jerks on the board.

How about it?



  

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The Opposition
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Re: Mousetraps Work because . . .
Reply #9 - Feb 6th, 2019 at 9:35pm
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kaz wrote on Feb 6th, 2019 at 4:59pm:
We're better off now than we would be with zero taxes.


I don't deny this.

kaz wrote on Feb 6th, 2019 at 4:59pm:
Anarchy has no more liberty than Marxism, even if we weren't conquered.


Practical liberty. You're talking about practical liberty, not ideal liberty.

In other words, you want freedoms you can actually use, not pie-in-the-sky freedom that doesn't benefit you because there are gangs everywhere robbing people and you'll probably die tomorrow.

Little Big Man wrote on Feb 5th, 2019 at 8:30pm:
. . . mice don't understand that there's no such thing as free cheese.


I thought of something very intelligent to say on this metaphor, that starts with eliminating the metaphor and just taking the statement literally.

Mice are opportunists, just like humans are. Mice are so close to us in so many ways (diet being a huge one) that they're the go-to laboratory animal. Results on mice have a good chance of applying to Humans.

Humans became opportunists when they came down out of the trees onto the Savannah and started eating whatever they could find. The first meat your species ate was almost certainly scavenged.

The thing is, to an opportunist, every meal is a free meal. His great intelligence only developed so he could think about and remember the most likely and most calorically profitable free meals to appear.

The conclusion?

I don't think Humans would have this freeloader problem quite as bad, if you evolved from a true predator. A Kzinti understands that for there to be meat, it has to be hunted. Someone hunted it! It's an intrinsic understanding that effort was expended which would have served you well through agrarian-style farming and beyond.

Instead, you evolved from opportunists, so sometimes, meat is just there.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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