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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Propertarianism - Private Property And Contracts (Read 900 times)
SkyChief
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Re: Propertarianism - Private Property And Contracts
Reply #40 - Feb 24th, 2019 at 10:47am
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kaz wrote on Feb 24th, 2019 at 9:34am:
That's not propertarian or parasitism.

In propertarianism, you do need a contract with your neighbor to violate his property rights.

Right -  I corrected myself in a later post:

SkyChief wrote on Feb 23rd, 2019 at 3:12pm:
It's complicated, but I think propertarianism is an off-shoot libertarian philosophy based on the ideals of self-ownership, the NAP,  private property, and contracts - both written and unwritten.
  
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kaz
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Re: Propertarianism - Private Property And Contracts
Reply #41 - Feb 24th, 2019 at 10:53am
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SkyChief wrote on Feb 24th, 2019 at 10:47am:
Right -  I corrected myself in a later post:



OK, thanks.  And yes, an oral agreement that you can land your plane as long as you keep going onto your own property would be fine.  As you said, it doesn't need to be written to be propertarian.

I think any real small government libertarian is mostly propertarian in that we believe protecting property rights and enforcing contracts should be the primary function of government.

That doesn't get us to other things though like the military, law enforcement, roads and that sort of thing though, it can't be all government is for it to work
  

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Jeff
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Re: Propertarianism - Private Property And Contracts
Reply #42 - Feb 24th, 2019 at 12:48pm
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kaz wrote on Feb 24th, 2019 at 9:34am:
In propertarianism, you do need a contract with your neighbor to violate his property rights.
I'm confused. If my neighbor and I have n agreement, I won't be violating his rights.
  

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Jeff
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Re: Propertarianism - Private Property And Contracts
Reply #43 - Feb 24th, 2019 at 12:50pm
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kaz wrote on Feb 24th, 2019 at 9:34am:
But you said you're not harming them so I went with that
It's really up to the property owner to decide if you do harm by using his property without permission, and he has a right to prevent even what might be seen as harmless trespass.
  

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Jeff
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Re: Propertarianism - Private Property And Contracts
Reply #44 - Feb 24th, 2019 at 12:54pm
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kaz wrote on Feb 24th, 2019 at 10:53am:
OK, thanks.  And yes, an oral agreement that you can land your plane as long as you keep going onto your own property would be fine.  As you said, it doesn't need to be written to be propertarian.

I think any real small government libertarian is mostly propertarian in that we believe protecting property rights and enforcing contracts should be the primary function of government.

That doesn't get us to other things though like the military, law enforcement, roads and that sort of thing though, it can't be all government is for it to work
Other than to introduce "taxes are bad" into the conversation, what's the point of "propertarianism"? I, just like you, don't see that there is anything at all new or different in it. It sounds like a standard libertarian approach to property rights with the addition of "taxes are bad", which makes it sound suspiciously like the anarchist idea of property rights.

I disagree in that protecting property rights (which enforcing contracts does) is 'a' primary function of government, not 'the' primary function of government.
  

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SkyChief
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Re: Propertarianism - Private Property And Contracts
Reply #45 - Feb 24th, 2019 at 1:14pm
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Jeff wrote on Feb 24th, 2019 at 12:54pm:
... It sounds like a standard libertarian approach to property rights with the addition of "taxes are bad", which makes it sound suspiciously like the anarchist idea of property rights.

I disagree in that protecting property rights (which enforcing contracts does) is 'a' primary function of government, not 'the' primary function of government.

Propertarinism is different from libertarianism, and at the same time similar in some ways.

Take Intellectual Property for example.

Libertarians see intellectual property as a form of aggression or coercion, a monopolistic violation of an individual’s legitimate privileges. 

Rothbard asserted that patents are invalid and “incompatible with the free market” .

Conversely, propertarians covet intellectual property. 
  
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Jeff
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Re: Propertarianism - Private Property And Contracts
Reply #46 - Feb 24th, 2019 at 1:59pm
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SkyChief wrote on Feb 24th, 2019 at 1:14pm:
Libertarians see intellectual property as a form of aggression or coercion, a monopolistic violation of an individual’s legitimate privileges. 

Rothbard asserted that patents are invalid and “incompatible with the free market” .

That's not the mainstream libertarian position. Rothbardian anarchy only appeals to the anarchist fringe.
  

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kaz
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Re: Propertarianism - Private Property And Contracts
Reply #47 - Feb 24th, 2019 at 2:03pm
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SkyChief wrote on Feb 24th, 2019 at 1:14pm:
Propertarinism is different from libertarianism, and at the same time similar in some ways.

Take Intellectual Property for example.

Libertarians see intellectual property as a form of aggression or coercion, a monopolistic violation of an individual’s legitimate privileges. 

Rothbard asserted that patents are invalid and “incompatible with the free market” .

Conversely, propertarians covet intellectual property. 


You're defining libertarians as anarchists again.  Most of us are not.  All the small government libertarians I know believe strongly in intellectual property
  

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