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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) "If We Only had One Branch, It Would do Whatever the Heck it Wants" (Read 1009 times)
Jeff
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Re: "If We Only had One Branch, It Would do Whatever the Heck it Wants"
Reply #50 - Feb 12th, 2019 at 3:23pm
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Little Big Man wrote on Feb 12th, 2019 at 3:02pm:
If the limits are that easy to ignore - which they are - they're not really limits.

It seems to have been fairly easy for FDR and his "progressive" Congress and the Supreme Court he cowed to get the 16th Amendment ratified and the Courts to start ignoring the limits on the taxing power... But would you really call that "easy"?

I think it never would have happened at all without help from the Federal Reserve Bank...

Sorry, mixed timelines.

Anyway, it couldn't have been easy to get the S. Ct. to make a decision as astoundingly bad as the Pollock decision could it? And then to get the 16th Amendment ratified and interpreted to mean that the taxing limits no longer applied.


  

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Re: "If We Only had One Branch, It Would do Whatever the Heck it Wants"
Reply #51 - Feb 12th, 2019 at 3:56pm
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Jeff wrote on Feb 12th, 2019 at 3:23pm:
It seems to have been fairly easy for FDR and his "progressive" Congress and the Supreme Court he cowed to get the 16th Amendment ratified and the Courts to start ignoring the limits on the taxing power... But would you really call that "easy"?

I think it never would have happened at all without help from the Federal Reserve Bank...

Sorry, mixed timelines.

Anyway, it couldn't have been easy to get the S. Ct. to make a decision as astoundingly bad as the Pollock decision could it? And then to get the 16th Amendment ratified and interpreted to mean that the taxing limits no longer applied.


I don't really get your objection to the Pollock decision.  Your objection seems to be based on a very narrow definition of "apportioned" that you haven't really explained yet.  I thought Pollock struck down a tax for not being apportioned so I would think that you would agree with that.

Anyway, when I say, "easy" I don't mean no work involved.  They had to work to convince the middle class that taxing those extremely wealthy people could never come back to bite the middle class.  Once they did that, the rest was easy and almost inevitable.

  

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Re: "If We Only had One Branch, It Would do Whatever the Heck it Wants"
Reply #52 - Feb 12th, 2019 at 6:38pm
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Little Big Man wrote on Feb 12th, 2019 at 3:56pm:
I don't really get your objection to the Pollock decision.
I've told you, the Pollock decision wrongly held that a tax on profits earned from the use of property was a Direct tax and illegal without apportionment. SCOTUS was correct that the Constitution requires Direct taxes to be apportioned, but absolutely out in the weeds in holding that a tax on profits was Direct. No court ever held that to be true either before or after the Pollock decision, and that bad decision has since been overturned piecemeal. The 16th Amendment is superfluous and should be repealed, especially because it's being used to defeat the Constitutional limits on the taxing power.
  

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Re: "If We Only had One Branch, It Would do Whatever the Heck it Wants"
Reply #53 - Feb 12th, 2019 at 6:45pm
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Little Big Man wrote on Feb 12th, 2019 at 3:56pm:
Anyway, when I say, "easy" I don't mean no work involved.  They had to work to convince the middle class that taxing those extremely wealthy people could never come back to bite the middle class.  Once they did that, the rest was easy and almost inevitable.

All that needed to be done after the 16th Amendment was ratified was to define wages and salaries as 'income' and they could start taking from working people what they had earned without apportionment.

The progressive tax on profits was much easier to accomplish after the states stopped appointing Senators, and it began as a very low rate on only very large incomes and an exemption and deduction that made working people completely exempt from the tax.

Who would complain about that? Especially when the "progressive" government needed money to do lots of really good things that could only be done by government... Like create a better society in America for people like Woodrow Wilson and anybody he approved of.
  

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