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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Bernie Sanders' "Medicare For All" Plan May Be Too Costly (Read 1411 times)
SkyChief
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Bernie Sanders' "Medicare For All" Plan May Be Too Costly
Apr 11th, 2019 at 4:50pm
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The vision is simple and socialist:

Government assumes control of all health care and Medical services.

All U.S. residents (including illegal aliens) would be covered with no copays and deductibles for medical services.  "Free" medical care for everyone!!

But all of this comes with a humongous price tag.    

$32.6 TRILLION over 10 years, according to a study by the Mercatus Center think tank at George Mason University in Virginia.

"[Sanders'] plan would require a massive tax hike on middle-class Americans, which leaves a bad taste in many taxpayers' mouth."

"Enacting something like 'Medicare for all' would be a transformative change in the size of the federal government." -  Kenneth Thorpe

"The tax increases are going to be enormous. There are going to be a lot of people who'll pay more in taxes than they save on premiums." - Kenneth Thorpe,  Health Policy professor at Emory University in Atlanta

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/study-medicare-for-all-plan-touted-by-bernie-sander...
  

Governments will always devise ways to deprive an honest man of his money or property, and claim that it's legal.
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Little Big Man
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Re: Bernie Sanders' "Medicare For All" Plan May Be Too Costly
Reply #1 - Apr 11th, 2019 at 5:02pm
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SkyChief wrote on Apr 11th, 2019 at 4:50pm:
The vision is simple and socialist:

Government assumes control of all health care and Medical service.

All U.S. residents (including illegal aliens) would be covered with no copays and deductibles for medical services.  "Free" medical care for everyone!!

But all of this comes with a humongous price tag.    

$32.6 TRILLION over 10 years, according to a study by the Mercatus Center think tank at George Mason University in Virginia.

"[Sanders'] plan would require a massive tax hike on middle-class Americans, which leaves a bad taste in many taxpayers' mouth."

"Enacting something like 'Medicare for all' would be a transformative change in the size of the federal government." -  Kenneth Thorpe

"The tax increases are going to be enormous. There are going to be a lot of people who'll pay more in taxes than they save on premiums." - Kenneth Thorpe,  Health Policy professor at Emory University in Atlanta

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/study-medicare-for-all-plan-touted-by-bernie-sander...



The only way for our current tax-and-spend trajectory to not end in disaster is to not only control our border but to control births as well through some sort of involuntary sterilization program.

People way we can have libertarianism, but we have to close the borders first.  No.  We have to close the borders if we want to continue to give “free” school to every child and “free” medical attention to every person.  We can open the borders if we are libertarian because a libertarian economy will not attract welfare layabouts.


  

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The Opposition
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Re: Bernie Sanders' "Medicare For All" Plan May Be Too Costly
Reply #2 - Apr 11th, 2019 at 9:42pm
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Little Big Man wrote on Apr 11th, 2019 at 5:02pm:
The only way for our current tax-and-spend trajectory to not end in disaster is to not only control our border but to control births as well through some sort of involuntary sterilization program.


When I was a statist I favoured this. But not involuntary. Volunteer for sterilisation and be set for life. Have a kid and you're on your own. No welfare. Ever.

Little Big Man wrote on Apr 11th, 2019 at 5:02pm:
People say we can have libertarianism, but we have to close the borders first.  No.  We have to close the borders if we want to continue to give “free” school to every child and “free” medical attention to every person.  We can open the borders if we are libertarian because a libertarian economy will not attract welfare layabouts.


I disagree. I think prosperity attracts them. There are more welfare rats receiving voluntary charity in downtown areas than there probably are ones getting government handouts in the same square area anywhere else.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
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kaz
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Re: Bernie Sanders' "Medicare For All" Plan May Be Too Costly
Reply #3 - Apr 12th, 2019 at 9:03am
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The Opposition wrote on Apr 11th, 2019 at 9:42pm:
When I was a statist I favoured this


Were you really a statist?  Or are you another one on the board who doesn't know what the word means?  It seems like the latter.

Statist does not mean non-anarchist.  The vast majority of people are neither anarchists nor statists
  

Contest winner:  I predicted Kaz' meltdown
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Little Big Man
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Re: Bernie Sanders' "Medicare For All" Plan May Be Too Costly
Reply #4 - Apr 12th, 2019 at 9:39am
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The Opposition wrote on Apr 11th, 2019 at 9:42pm:
When I was a statist I favoured this. But not involuntary. Volunteer for sterilisation and be set for life. Have a kid and you're on your own. No welfare. Ever.


I disagree. I think prosperity attracts them. There are more welfare rats receiving voluntary charity in downtown areas than there probably are ones getting government handouts in the same square area anywhere else.


I think that there is some truth to that.    Gun to my head, I have to be a layabout, I’d rather be a layabout in a rich country than a poor one. 
  

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SkyChief
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Re: Bernie Sanders' "Medicare For All" Plan May Be Too Costly
Reply #5 - Apr 20th, 2019 at 1:43pm
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A recent study found that 2 out of 5 Bernie supporters are just as ignorant as the other 3.
  

Governments will always devise ways to deprive an honest man of his money or property, and claim that it's legal.
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Jeff
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Re: Bernie Sanders' "Medicare For All" Plan May Be Too Costly
Reply #6 - Apr 20th, 2019 at 2:08pm
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SkyChief wrote on Apr 11th, 2019 at 4:50pm:
The vision is simple and socialist:

Government assumes control of all health care and Medical services.

All U.S. residents (including illegal aliens) would be covered with no copays and deductibles for medical services.  "Free" medical care for everyone!!

But all of this comes with a humongous price tag.    

$32.6 TRILLION over 10 years, according to a study by the Mercatus Center think tank at George Mason University in Virginia.

"[Sanders'] plan would require a massive tax hike on middle-class Americans, which leaves a bad taste in many taxpayers' mouth."

"Enacting something like 'Medicare for all' would be a transformative change in the size of the federal government." -  Kenneth Thorpe

"The tax increases are going to be enormous. There are going to be a lot of people who'll pay more in taxes than they save on premiums." - Kenneth Thorpe,  Health Policy professor at Emory University in Atlanta

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/study-medicare-for-all-plan-touted-by-bernie-sander...
"Free" medical care for all will only cost as much as Congress appropriates to fund it.

If Congress funds "Medicare for All" at a level of 1/3 of what is currently spent in the U.S. on medical care, then that's what it will cost, and there will be an immediate huge savings overall!

Of course medical care will be greatly altered and rich people and politicians will start going to other countries for expensive treatment that isn't in the budget...

Edit: Will buying private medical insurance be outlawed and insurance companies forbidden to sell medical care polices? Maybe all the people put out of work for insurance companies could become doctors like they have in Cuba?
  

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SkyChief
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Re: Bernie Sanders' "Medicare For All" Plan May Be Too Costly
Reply #7 - Apr 20th, 2019 at 2:30pm
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Jeff wrote on Apr 20th, 2019 at 2:08pm:
"Free" medical care for all will only cost as much as Congress appropriates to fund it.

If Congress funds "Medicare for All" at a level of 1/3 of what is currently spent in the U.S. on medical care, then that's what it will cost, and there will be an immediate huge savings overall!

No offense, but I'm trusting the Mercatus Center's estimate of $32.6 Trillion over 10 years.

That seems to be a fairly conservative estimate - other estimates have put the price tag @ roughly $3 Trillion per year.

U.S. Sen. Ron Johnson, said during a Sept. 4. 2018, interview:

"You could double every American’s tax bill and it still wouldn’t pay for it.

It's a ridiculous socialist scheme that would bankrupt Americans, and really hurt the economy by taking taxpayer's discretionary money.
  

Governments will always devise ways to deprive an honest man of his money or property, and claim that it's legal.
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kaz
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Re: Bernie Sanders' "Medicare For All" Plan May Be Too Costly
Reply #8 - Apr 20th, 2019 at 2:42pm
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SkyChief wrote on Apr 20th, 2019 at 2:30pm:
No offense, but I'm trusting the Mercatus Center's estimate of $32.6 Trillion over 10 years.

That seems to be a fairly conservative estimate - other estimates have put the price tag @ roughly $3 Trillion per year.

U.S. Sen. Ron Johnson, said during a Sept. 4. 2018, interview:

"You could double every American’s tax bill and it still wouldn’t pay for it.

It's a ridiculous socialist scheme that would bankrupt Americans, and really hurt the economy by taking taxpayer's discretionary money.


So you don't think congress is going to go to seniors and say they are eliminating 2/3 of what government spends on their medicare and spread the remaining third across all Americans?

Huh, I don't either ...
  

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Jeff
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Re: Bernie Sanders' "Medicare For All" Plan May Be Too Costly
Reply #9 - Apr 20th, 2019 at 10:28pm
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SkyChief wrote on Apr 20th, 2019 at 2:30pm:
No offense, but I'm trusting the Mercatus Center's estimate of $32.6 Trillion over 10 years.

That seems to be a fairly conservative estimate - other estimates have put the price tag @ roughly $3 Trillion per year.

They are estimating based on the level of medical care that is currently provided, on average?

What assurance is there that medical care will be maintained at the current level that rich people get? Or even at the level provided by medicare? None. And it won't because there isn't enough money to do that.

The reality of Medicare for All will not be huge new expenditures, but reductions in service.

Reductions in service are affordable.
  

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