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Little Big Man
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“Eventual Elimination of Taxes”
Apr 17th, 2019 at 10:37am
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That’s the Libertarian Party platform.  Is it realistic?

Yes, so long as you don’t forget the word, “eventual.”

Statists have had centuries to install a system that is dependent on government so taxes cannot be eliminated in the short-term.  Since short-term is all statists usuallly think about, they are fine with that.

But there is a big difference between realizing that taxes cannot be Eliminated tomorrow and saying, “but we’ll always have taxes to pay for _________ because things wouldn’t be fair without __________.”

If you justify a permanent acceptance that government “must” keep extorting money from producers and workers for any reason, that is an honest position.  But it’s not a libertarian position.  Particularly if your reason has something to do with being “fair to the poor.”  We’ll always have poor people, no matter what system we live under, so the principle that taxes have to taken as long as there are poor who need “fairness” means taxes are permanent.

So yourself a favor and go find a GOP, Dem, Socialist National Socialist, International socialist or whatever site to post on.  You will be welcome there and not wasting people’s time.
  

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kaz
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Re: “Eventual Elimination of Taxes”
Reply #1 - Apr 17th, 2019 at 10:48am
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Little Big Man wrote on Apr 17th, 2019 at 10:37am:
That’s the Libertarian Party platform.  Is it realistic?

Yes, so long as you don’t forget the word, “eventual.”

Statists have had centuries to install a system that is dependent on government so taxes cannot be eliminated in the short-term.  Since short-term is all statists usuallly think about, they are fine with that.

But there is a big difference between realizing that taxes cannot be Eliminated tomorrow and saying, “but we’ll always have taxes to pay for _________ because things wouldn’t be fair without __________.”

If you justify a permanent acceptance that government “must” keep extorting money from producers and workers for any reason, that is an honest position.  But it’s not a libertarian position.  Particularly if your reason has something to do with being “fair to the poor.”  We’ll always have poor people, no matter what system we live under, so the principle that taxes have to taken as long as there are poor who need “fairness” means taxes are permanent.

So yourself a favor and go find a GOP, Dem, Socialist National Socialist, International socialist or whatever site to post on.  You will be welcome there and not wasting people’s time.




Libertarianism is a death pact, you've mentioned that.  And you constantly end these angry rants with shit like that, which is why I keep calling you out for being the troll that you are, Don.

If you wanted a discussion, you wouldn't do that.  You just want a reaction.  You're a troll
  

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Jeff
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Re: “Eventual Elimination of Taxes”
Reply #2 - Apr 17th, 2019 at 5:02pm
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Little Big Man wrote on Apr 17th, 2019 at 10:37am:
That’s the Libertarian Party platform.  Is it realistic?

Yes, so long as you don’t forget the word, “eventual.”

Statists have had centuries to install a system that is dependent on government so taxes cannot be eliminated in the short-term.  Since short-term is all statists usuallly think about, they are fine with that.

But there is a big difference between realizing that taxes cannot be Eliminated tomorrow and saying, “but we’ll always have taxes to pay for _________ because things wouldn’t be fair without __________.”

If you justify a permanent acceptance that government “must” keep extorting money from producers and workers for any reason, that is an honest position.  But it’s not a libertarian position.  Particularly if your reason has something to do with being “fair to the poor.”  We’ll always have poor people, no matter what system we live under, so the principle that taxes have to taken as long as there are poor who need “fairness” means taxes are permanent.

So yourself a favor and go find a GOP, Dem, Socialist National Socialist, International socialist or whatever site to post on.  You will be welcome there and not wasting people’s time.
Who did you imagine you were talking at? The lizard? Grin
  

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Jeff
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Re: “Eventual Elimination of Taxes”
Reply #3 - Apr 18th, 2019 at 8:25am
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It seems that our current government is doing a good job of completely eliminating taxes for certain large corporations:

https://www.foxbusiness.com/economy/amazon-netflix-chevron-ibm-federal-taxes-tru...

That fits right in with what you want, right Chief? No taxes on profits.
  

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SkyChief
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Re: “Eventual Elimination of Taxes”
Reply #4 - Apr 18th, 2019 at 11:22am
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Jeff wrote on Apr 18th, 2019 at 8:25am:
It seems that our current government is doing a good job of completely eliminating taxes for certain large corporations:

That fits right in with what you want, right Chief? No taxes on profits.

Yes!  Praise Athena! 

No direct taxes on profits or income or earnings of any kind.

Imagine the tremendous economic growth that would instantly happen!   Smiley

The US would be the envy of the world.  Foreign investors would be knocking each other down to buy in to the growth at the bottom floor.
  
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kaz
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Re: “Eventual Elimination of Taxes”
Reply #5 - Apr 18th, 2019 at 11:36am
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SkyChief wrote on Apr 18th, 2019 at 11:22am:
Yes!  Praise Athena! 

No direct taxes on profits or income or earnings of any kind.

Imagine the tremendous economic growth that would instantly happen!   Smiley

The US would be the envy of the world.  Foreign investors would be knocking each other down to buy in to the growth at the bottom floor.


Smiley

Taxing profits is so stupid because it punishes efficient companies
  

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Jeff
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Re: “Eventual Elimination of Taxes”
Reply #6 - Apr 18th, 2019 at 3:43pm
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kaz wrote on Apr 18th, 2019 at 11:36am:
Smiley

Taxing profits is so stupid because it punishes efficient companies
Businesses that don't make any profit are unprofitable and go out of business. In the real world anyway.

Your "sales tax" will punish companies that make products for which they use other products that they don't make themselves, while rewarding companies that make everything they need for their final product in house.

Explain why the IRS will be obligated to issue Federal Sales Tax IDs (exemptions) like states do, and I'll listen to your idea and believe it can be accomplished without becoming a VAT.

I like the idea of taxing imports uniformly, all imports taxed at the same rate, and nothing else taxed at all by the federal government.
  

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Jeff
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Re: “Eventual Elimination of Taxes”
Reply #7 - Apr 18th, 2019 at 3:48pm
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SkyChief wrote on Apr 18th, 2019 at 11:22am:
Yes!  Praise Athena! 

No direct taxes on profits or income or earnings of any kind.

Imagine the tremendous economic growth that would instantly happen!   Smiley

The US would be the envy of the world.  Foreign investors would be knocking each other down to buy in to the growth at the bottom floor.
But they aren't taxing profits uniformly, and it's obviously possible to earn huge amounts of money and not make any profit.

Let's make sure wages and salaries are defined as gross income, and only tax a persons "profit" on their gross income. That means if you reinvest all your wages/salary in yourself, you have no profit to tax. Why should corporate "income" be any different than personal "income"?
  

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kaz
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Re: “Eventual Elimination of Taxes”
Reply #8 - Apr 18th, 2019 at 3:55pm
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Jeff wrote on Apr 18th, 2019 at 3:43pm:
Businesses that don't make any profit are unprofitable and go out of business. In the real world anyway.

Your "sales tax" will punish companies that make products for which they use other products that they don't make themselves, while rewarding companies that make everything they need for their final product in house.

Explain why the IRS will be obligated to issue Federal Sales Tax IDs (exemptions) like states do, and I'll listen to your idea and believe it can be accomplished without becoming a VAT.

I like the idea of taxing imports uniformly, all imports taxed at the same rate, and nothing else taxed at all by the federal government.


I know you're stupid, so this isn't for you.  But for anyone else who reads this, this is a lie.  The fair tax replaces all the other taxes.  It's not a new tax on top of the others.

Jeff:   OMG, if you take taxes out of products, then put the taxes back in, then the company will go out of business!

Stupid is as stupid says ...
  

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Jeff
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Re: “Eventual Elimination of Taxes”
Reply #9 - Apr 18th, 2019 at 4:19pm
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kaz wrote on Apr 18th, 2019 at 3:55pm:
I know you're stupid, so this isn't for you.  But for anyone else who reads this, this is a lie.  The fair tax replaces all the other taxes.  It's not a new tax on top of the others.

OK, great, how will the Constitutional amendment that makes only the "fair tax" legal be worded so as to prevent every possible taxable event from being reached by the tax?

Will it include language requiring that almost all businesses be issued an exemption in the form of a Federal Tax ID?

Will it be made clear that only sales to non-incorporated individuals who don't resell the product will be taxed?

If Walmart has a great deal on toasters and I buy 1000 of them and resell them at a profit to me, will that purchase be exempt? (And of course I'll have to collect the "fair tax" on my resales... Grin)

I'll assume I can get a Federal Tax ID as an individual who might occasionally want to buy things for resale. Is that going to be difficult? Will I have to incorporate?
  

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