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The Opposition
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IP Protects Fiat Currency
Jul 27th, 2019 at 11:56pm
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...It does.

In a totally libertarian system, with intellectual property laws, printers of a fiat currency - let's say, the bollar - would have grounds against anyone printing "fake" bollars. They "own" the concept of the bollar, so no one else can print a "real" one.

In a totally libertarian system without intellectual property rights, no one could successfully print a fiat currency. If their bollar is their promise to give you a gram of gold, then they have grounds against people trying to fake their promises. But if their bollars have no value beyond being bollars, anything that can pass as a bollar is a bollar. No harm no foul.

Successful fiat currency requires lots of planning to get away with. You generally want to back it at first and slowly erode your promises until everyone has nothing but they're left holding a bunch of bollars and they have nothing else to spend. Cue the overprint and inflate phase, transferring wealth from the current holders of bollars to you, the printer of new bollars.

With no intellectual property, in a libertarian system, the inflation phase would see everyone printing new bollars and no one would gain disproportionate riches. In fact, as soon as the promise was technically void, everyone could start printing.

What this means in practice is that you void your promise to back your currency, and you void your currency that instant.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Jeff
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Re: IP Protects Fiat Currency
Reply #1 - Jul 28th, 2019 at 7:48am
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The Opposition wrote on Jul 27th, 2019 at 11:56pm:
In a totally libertarian system without intellectual property rights...
A system of government that doesn't protect intellectual property rights isn't protecting property rights, so you can't call it a "libertarian" system of government.
  

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Jeff
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Re: IP Protects Fiat Currency
Reply #2 - Jul 28th, 2019 at 7:50am
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The Opposition wrote on Jul 27th, 2019 at 11:56pm:
Successful fiat currency requires lots of planning to get away with.
To print fiat currency and force it into circulation requires only that the government have the power to pass laws making the fiat currency legal tender.
  

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Tommy Palven
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Re: IP Protects Fiat Currency
Reply #3 - Jul 28th, 2019 at 8:10am
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Jeff wrote on Jul 28th, 2019 at 7:48am:
A system of government that doesn't protect intellectual property rights isn't protecting property rights, so you can't call it a "libertarian" system of government.


"Intellectual property rights" are bogus rights, imvho, Jeff, just as bogus as the "right to a living wage" or the "right to free beer."

Violating "intellectual property rights" doesn't involve the use of coercion, and so-called violations are victimless crimes despite what the deep state bureaucrats of the FBI have to say about the subject.
  
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Jeff
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Re: IP Protects Fiat Currency
Reply #4 - Jul 28th, 2019 at 11:39am
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Tommy Palven wrote on Jul 28th, 2019 at 8:10am:
"Intellectual property rights" are bogus rights, imvho, Jeff...
You don't think that an inventor should have a time-limited right to profit from his invention by being granted a temporary exclusive right to it? No patents or copyrights should be issued?

If you steal my idea, my invention, my screenplay, you say it's not theft?
  

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The Opposition
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Re: IP Protects Fiat Currency
Reply #5 - Jul 28th, 2019 at 11:43am
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Tommy Palven wrote on Jul 28th, 2019 at 8:10am:
Violating "intellectual property rights" doesn't involve the use of coercion, and so-called violations are victimless crimes despite what the deep state bureaucrats of the FBI have to say about the subject.


This is a circular argument. If you believe intellectual property is really property, then violating it is not a victimless crime.

The victims are harmed: They lose a sale. They lose profits. Most importantly the right they have to prevent anyone else from creating their idea is violated.

Jeff wrote on Jul 28th, 2019 at 7:48am:
A system of government that doesn't protect intellectual property rights isn't protecting property rights, so you can't call it a "libertarian" system of government.


Touche. Pretend I said "otherwise libertarian" instead.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Tommy Palven
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Re: IP Protects Fiat Currency
Reply #6 - Jul 28th, 2019 at 11:59am
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Jeff wrote on Jul 28th, 2019 at 11:39am:
You don't think that an inventor should have a time-limited right to profit from his invention by being granted a temporary exclusive right to it? No patents or copyrights should be issued?

If you steal my idea, my invention, my screenplay, you say it's not theft?


No, that's not theft.

Find other ways to protect your ideas and screenplays or look at other ways to earn a living instead of getting taxpayers to pay to protect your profits.
  
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Jeff
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Re: IP Protects Fiat Currency
Reply #7 - Jul 28th, 2019 at 12:08pm
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Tommy Palven wrote on Jul 28th, 2019 at 11:59am:
No, that's not theft.

Find other ways to protect your ideas and screenplays or look at other ways to earn a living instead of getting taxpayers to pay to protect your profits.
Well, seeing that I only write screenplays and don't make movies, I have to find someone interested enough in my screenplay to turn it into a movie...

But you say if I take it to a producer, and he likes it, he can just steal it and make it into a movie, and that's OK?

What I'm talking about is a government that will protect my rights.
  

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Tommy Palven
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Re: IP Protects Fiat Currency
Reply #8 - Jul 28th, 2019 at 1:24pm
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Jeff wrote on Jul 28th, 2019 at 12:08pm:
Well, seeing that I only write screenplays and don't make movies, I have to find someone interested enough in my screenplay to turn it into a movie...

But you say if I take it to a producer, and he likes it, he can just steal it and make it into a movie, and that's OK?

What I'm talking about is a government that will protect my rights.



Produce it yourself, star in it, don't produce it, or whatever.

You figure it out.

How do you acquire a right to tax me, a working stiff, to protect your screenplay?
  
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The Opposition
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Re: IP Protects Fiat Currency
Reply #9 - Jul 28th, 2019 at 3:20pm
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Tommy Palven wrote on Jul 28th, 2019 at 11:59am:
No, that's not theft.

Find other ways to protect your ideas and screenplays or look at other ways to earn a living instead of getting taxpayers to pay to protect your profits.


Wow. A libertarian who doesn't believe in property rights. Now I've seen everything.

Note that I never said IP wasn't a legitimate property right. I just pointed out that it protects fiat currency.

Tommy Palven wrote on Jul 28th, 2019 at 1:24pm:
How do you acquire a right to tax me, a working stiff, to protect your screenplay?


What a ridiculous strawman.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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