Libertarian's Forum
Libertarian Forum to discuss politics and free market economics.
Libertarian's ForumLibertarian's ForumFreedom Forum › Currency is a Non-Excludable Good
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 ... 5 6 [7] 8  Send TopicPrint
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Currency is a Non-Excludable Good (Read 801 times)
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 45089
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Currency is a Non-Excludable Good
Reply #60 - Aug 13th, 2019 at 6:45am
Print Post  
Jacob wrote on Aug 11th, 2019 at 1:12pm:
In other words, a public utility.

I'm taking a stand based on idea from Economics for Dummies, one of my introductory books of choice for economics.

I'm making my stand here in favor of fiat currency (not for inflation mind you) because I also want to hear your arguments in case you favor a gold or silver standard instead.

Quote from the text:
"... A lighthouse provides warning services to all ships in the vicinity regardless of whether they pay the lighthouse keeper. Because every ship knows that it can get the service without having to pay for it, the private lighthouse quickly goes bankrupt because only a few ships are fair-minded enough to pay for the service."

I think that currency itself is a public good. Everyone has to have access to it in order to facilitate trade. If the money supply is restricted by a limited resource like gold, only a few people benefit from having lots of it, with everyone else having to fend for their own stash of gold in a shoebox.

Again, I am not defending deliberate inflation, which only increases the price of goods in response to the artificially supply of money. While a gold standard does answer the problems of inflation, it doesn't answer to the fact that money itself has to be more accessible than everyone owning their own vault and security system to protect literal hunks of metal.
Private lighthouses existed and maybe still do.

Currency is fine as I.O.U.s

Banks used to print currency (called bank notes) that were I.O.U.s for gold or silver. Hey, so did governments!

Didn't Economics for Dummies teach you about the role of real money in controlling interest rates in a free economy? Or about the natural cycles in a free economy that are driven by a process of creative destruction that acts to send resources (including money) to where they will be put to the best use?

Had I mentioned your theory that money is a non-excludable good to my parents, they would have nodded and said, "If you want money, earn it".

How do you plan to prevent a fiat currency from being inflated?

Apparently you weren't taught any public choice theory in your economics course either, or you would know that politicians will inflate fiat currencies because it benefits them... Do you think politicians will limit their power to benefit themselves?
  

"Free hate speech"
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 45089
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Currency is a Non-Excludable Good
Reply #61 - Aug 13th, 2019 at 6:52am
Print Post  
Jacob wrote on Aug 12th, 2019 at 11:40am:
I can accept that the Central Bank itself is non-partisan.
Whoever is in charge of the ship makes a huge difference.
Yes, it benefits the bankers to support whoever is in power, probably because if they don't, they'll find they are no longer in charge of the central bank and can't create money out of thin air any more.
  

"Free hate speech"
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jacob
Libertarians Full Member
***
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 173
Joined: Aug 3rd, 2019
Re: Currency is a Non-Excludable Good
Reply #62 - Aug 13th, 2019 at 7:58am
Print Post  
Jeff wrote on Aug 13th, 2019 at 6:45am:
Private lighthouses existed and maybe still do.

Currency is fine as I.O.U.s

Banks used to print currency (called bank notes) that were I.O.U.s for gold or silver. Hey, so did governments!

Didn't Economics for Dummies teach you about the role of real money in controlling interest rates in a free economy? Or about the natural cycles in a free economy that are driven by a process of creative destruction that acts to send resources (including money) to where they will be put to the best use?

Had I mentioned your theory that money is a non-excludable good to my parents, they would have nodded and said, "If you want money, earn it".

How do you plan to prevent a fiat currency from being inflated?

Apparently you weren't taught any public choice theory in your economics course either, or you would know that politicians will inflate fiat currencies because it benefits them... Do you think politicians will limit their power to benefit themselves?


I only just started reading it. Apparently not far enough... Thanks Jeff
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 45089
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Currency is a Non-Excludable Good
Reply #63 - Aug 13th, 2019 at 8:12am
Print Post  
Jacob wrote on Aug 13th, 2019 at 7:58am:
I only just started reading it. Apparently not far enough... Thanks Jeff
I've not read it, so I can't be sure, but there are many books on economics that teach Keynesian and/or Marxist theories, generally trying to prove that free economies can't work by citing examples of problems caused by crony capitalism.
  

"Free hate speech"
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jacob
Libertarians Full Member
***
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 173
Joined: Aug 3rd, 2019
Re: Currency is a Non-Excludable Good
Reply #64 - Aug 13th, 2019 at 10:37pm
Print Post  
Jeff wrote on Aug 13th, 2019 at 8:12am:
I've not read it, so I can't be sure, but there are many books on economics that teach Keynesian and/or Marxist theories, generally trying to prove that free economies can't work by citing examples of problems caused by crony capitalism.


It does have Marx as a top ten economist, but it does say that his theories were bunk. Not sure how the book squares with Keynes yet.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
yamcha
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 644
Location: Southern California
Joined: Jul 5th, 2019
Re: Currency is a Non-Excludable Good
Reply #65 - Aug 13th, 2019 at 10:40pm
Print Post  
Marx the fiction writer as one of the greatest economists?
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jacob
Libertarians Full Member
***
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 173
Joined: Aug 3rd, 2019
Re: Currency is a Non-Excludable Good
Reply #66 - Aug 13th, 2019 at 10:42pm
Print Post  
yamcha wrote on Aug 13th, 2019 at 10:40pm:
Marx the fiction writer as one of the greatest economists?


Not greatest, but most influential.
He did influence people, if in the wrong direction.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 45089
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Currency is a Non-Excludable Good
Reply #67 - Aug 14th, 2019 at 7:23am
Print Post  
Jacob wrote on Aug 13th, 2019 at 10:37pm:
It does have Marx as a top ten economist, but it does say that his theories were bunk. Not sure how the book squares with Keynes yet.
What's the entire top ten list?
  

"Free hate speech"
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 45089
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Currency is a Non-Excludable Good
Reply #68 - Aug 14th, 2019 at 7:35am
Print Post  
Alan Greenspan says people will be happy to buy treasury bonds at a guaranteed loss even before inflation...

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/ex-fed-boss-greenspan-says-there-is-no-barrier...

Things have to be really bad for that to happen...
  

"Free hate speech"
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Jacob
Libertarians Full Member
***
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 173
Joined: Aug 3rd, 2019
Re: Currency is a Non-Excludable Good
Reply #69 - Aug 15th, 2019 at 12:19pm
Print Post  
Jeff wrote on Aug 14th, 2019 at 7:23am:
What's the entire top ten list?


Adam Smith
David Ricardo
Karl Marx
Alfred Marshall
John Maynard Keynes
Kenneth Arrow & Gerrard Debreu
Milton Friedman
Paul Samuelson
Robert Solow
Gary Becker
Robert Lucas
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 ... 5 6 [7] 8 
Send TopicPrint
 
Libertarian's ForumLibertarian's ForumFreedom Forum › Currency is a Non-Excludable Good
Libertarian's Forum

Libertarian's Forum Information Rules, Agreement and Privacy Policy