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Poll closed Question: Libertarian Forum Rights Reallocation Act of 2019
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*** This poll has now closed ***


Yes: Reallocate Rights    
  2 (66.7%)
No: Those With More Rights Don't Have to Share    
  0 (0.0%)
Everyone Has Equal Rights; The Act Does Nothing*    
  1 (33.3%)




Total votes: 3
« Created by: The Opposition on: Aug 25th, 2019 at 7:27pm »
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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Libertarians Forum Rights Reallocation Act of 2019 (Read 544 times)
The Opposition
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Libertarians Forum Rights Reallocation Act of 2019
Aug 25th, 2019 at 7:27pm
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The Libertarian Forum Rights Reallocation Act of 2019 would redistribute the basic rights (not contract rights or other acquired rights) of all members so that all members of Libertarian's Forum have equal basic rights.

I thought that we should allow the community to decide, as an acid-test for whether anything can ever legitimately be taken from one and given to another even in the case of community agreement.

It's such a good test because rights represent pure legitimacy; there's no messy question of whether you can stop people from taking them. If it's not legitimate to take them, they can't be taken.

* Note that if you vote for Option 3, stating that the LFRRA does nothing, you concede that those in favour have a right to enforce the LFRRA since they are doing nothing, and everyone may always (in absence of prior agreement or responsibility) do nothing.

A legitimate basic right may never compel anyone else to positive action, so the universal negative action - doing nothing - is always permissible.

If the LFRRA does nothing, then anyone may enact and enforce... nothing.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Jeff
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Re: Libertarians Forum Rights Reallocation Act of 2019
Reply #1 - Aug 25th, 2019 at 7:58pm
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The Opposition wrote on Aug 25th, 2019 at 7:27pm:
The Libertarian Forum Rights Reallocation Act of 2019 would redistribute the basic rights (not contract rights or other acquired rights) of all members so that all members of Libertarian's Forum have equal basic rights.

I thought that we should allow the community to decide...
Has the moderator agreed to that?

What you seem to be saying is the you want rights re-distributed to you?

Tsk tsk. How can you say you aren't an authoritarian?
  

"Free hate speech"
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The Opposition
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Re: Libertarians Forum Rights Reallocation Act of 2019
Reply #2 - Aug 25th, 2019 at 8:21pm
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Jeff wrote on Aug 25th, 2019 at 7:58pm:
Has the moderator agreed to that?


Does he have to? I think the community should decide.

Jeff wrote on Aug 25th, 2019 at 7:58pm:
What you seem to be saying is the you want rights re-distributed to you?


Again, I think the community should decide if that happens or not.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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SkyChief
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Re: Libertarians Forum Rights Reallocation Act of 2019
Reply #3 - Aug 25th, 2019 at 9:43pm
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Some of my favorite quotes on rights and liberty:

"Statism is political fashion.  Individual liberty is eternal."  -  A.E Samaan

"A man’s rights rest in three boxes. The ballot-box, the jury-box, and the cartridge-box." - Frederick Douglas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Friedrich Nietzsche

"The Court has simultaneously transformed judicially created rights like the right to abortion into preferred constitutional rights, while disfavoring many of the rights actually enumerated in the Constitution" - Judge Clarence Thomas

"If a change in policy makes you both: worse off than you were under the previous policy, and worse off than you would be in a state of nature, you may object to the policy change on those grounds alone" - Opposition

"A law either infringes a constitutional right, or not; there is no room for the judiciary to invent tolerable degrees of encroachment." - Judge Clarence Thomas

"It's government's job to respect and protect the rights of the individual. That vision is centrally important to the principle put forth by the Founding Fathers. If you don't believe that, you shouldn't be in Congress." - Bill Sali

"Any time power is granted to the government, it is done at the expense of the liberty of the governed."  - SkyChief

And the most clueless:

“People do not have the right to unregulated rights in this country.” - Al Sharpton

  
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The Opposition
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Re: Libertarians Forum Rights Reallocation Act of 2019
Reply #4 - Aug 25th, 2019 at 10:05pm
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SkyChief wrote on Aug 25th, 2019 at 9:43pm:
"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Friedrich Nietzsche


That is exactly what I am doing in the only way I can: By acting within the bounds of the rules established by others, because I make the rules for no man. I prefer that he should be free.

If someone says to me, "Opposition, you do have to pay for public school for others, because the community should decide," then I say alright, let the community decide things like that.

I have a lot of hubris but not enough to think I can make the rules for others.

If you respect Jeff more than me, vote no. He has more rights than me and he shouldn't be forced to share them.

If you believe I have the same rights as Jeff, there's no harm in voting yes (or 3) because the result of the LFRRA is exactly nothing.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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SkyChief
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Re: Libertarians Forum Rights Reallocation Act of 2019
Reply #5 - Aug 25th, 2019 at 11:08pm
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The Opposition wrote on Aug 25th, 2019 at 10:05pm:
If you respect Jeff more than me, vote no. He has more rights than me and he shouldn't be forced to share them.

If you believe I have the same rights as Jeff, there's no harm in voting yes (or 3) because the result of the LFRRA is exactly nothing.
Ok thanks.   I have voted in your poll. 

Unfortunately, due to the unusually small pool of participants, Polls on libertariansforum.com  are not very conclusive.

The Opposition wrote on Aug 25th, 2019 at 10:05pm:
If someone says to me, "Opposition, you do have to pay for public school for others, because the community should decide," then I say alright, let the community decide things like that.
We are very different in this regard.

If someone says to me, "SkyChief, you do have to pay for public school for others, because the community should decide,",  I'll tell them:

"You may have the power to take my money by coercion, but you'll never have the right.   So get off my property and don't ever come come back - - you're no longer welcome here.     Now, GIT!

Smiley
  
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Jeff
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Re: Libertarians Forum Rights Reallocation Act of 2019
Reply #6 - Aug 26th, 2019 at 7:44am
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The Opposition wrote on Aug 25th, 2019 at 8:21pm:
Does he have to? I think the community should decide.


Again, I think the community should decide if that happens or not.
Why? The "community" doesn't own the forum.
  

"Free hate speech"
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Jeff
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Re: Libertarians Forum Rights Reallocation Act of 2019
Reply #7 - Aug 26th, 2019 at 7:45am
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SkyChief wrote on Aug 25th, 2019 at 9:43pm:
Some of my favorite quotes on rights and liberty:

"Statism is political fashion.  Individual liberty is eternal."  -  A.E Samaan

"A man’s rights rest in three boxes. The ballot-box, the jury-box, and the cartridge-box." - Frederick Douglas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Friedrich Nietzsche

"The Court has simultaneously transformed judicially created rights like the right to abortion into preferred constitutional rights, while disfavoring many of the rights actually enumerated in the Constitution" - Judge Clarence Thomas

"If a change in policy makes you both: worse off than you were under the previous policy, and worse off than you would be in a state of nature, you may object to the policy change on those grounds alone" - Opposition

"A law either infringes a constitutional right, or not; there is no room for the judiciary to invent tolerable degrees of encroachment." - Judge Clarence Thomas

"It's government's job to respect and protect the rights of the individual. That vision is centrally important to the principle put forth by the Founding Fathers. If you don't believe that, you shouldn't be in Congress." - Bill Sali

"Any time power is granted to the government, it is done at the expense of the liberty of the governed."  - SkyChief

And the most clueless:

“People do not have the right to unregulated rights in this country.” - Al Sharpton

http://replygif.net/i/1339.gif
Justice Thomas is great, isn't he?
  

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The Opposition
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Re: Libertarians Forum Rights Reallocation Act of 2019
Reply #8 - Aug 26th, 2019 at 10:37am
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Jeff wrote on Aug 26th, 2019 at 7:44am:
Why? The "community" doesn't own the forum.


So should the community still decide if taxes should be taken for public school if they all rent?
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Jeff
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Re: Libertarians Forum Rights Reallocation Act of 2019
Reply #9 - Aug 26th, 2019 at 12:18pm
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The Opposition wrote on Aug 26th, 2019 at 10:37am:
So should the community still decide if taxes should be taken for public school if they all rent?
Sure.
  

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