Libertarian's Forum
Libertarian Forum to discuss politics and free market economics.
Libertarian's ForumLibertarian's ForumFreedom Forum › Adam Schiff is Doing Something Great for the Nation. If . . .
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 ... 7 8 [9] 10 11 12 Send TopicPrint
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Adam Schiff is Doing Something Great for the Nation. If . . . (Read 1103 times)
Jeff
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 50754
Location: USA
Joined: Feb 26th, 2014
Re: Adam Schiff is Doing Something Great for the Nation. If . . .
Reply #80 - Nov 17th, 2019 at 3:47pm
Print Post  
kaz wrote on Nov 17th, 2019 at 3:42pm:
It's about scale.  Right now, even a billionaire can't call and say to arrest LBM on a trumped up charge because he wants to take your property that is adjacent to his.  In your system where government can't survive without "donations," he could do that.

It's butt obvious how dependent on the rich government would be if the rich were their ONLY source of income as you advocate.

It's why no taxes = anarchy.  All government is voluntary.  And voluntary means that public servants would actually be in the employ of those who pay them.  Anarchy = despotism, there is no difference.
Good points kaz.
  

"Free hate speech"
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
The Opposition
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Online

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 11995
Joined: Apr 30th, 2014
Re: Adam Schiff is Doing Something Great for the Nation. If . . .
Reply #81 - Nov 17th, 2019 at 4:09pm
Print Post  
kaz wrote on Nov 17th, 2019 at 3:42pm:
It's about scale.  Right now, even a billionaire can't call and say to arrest LBM on a trumped up charge because he wants to take your property that is adjacent to his.  In your system where government can't survive without "donations," he could do that.


He can. And he doesn't even need the billions, though I'm sure they help. There are a billion rules about how you have to keep your property to avoid fines and everyone is breaking at least some of them. Nasty neighbours can fine people they don't like out of the neighbourhood. Once one violation is fixed, another can be found.

kaz wrote on Nov 17th, 2019 at 3:42pm:
It's butt obvious how dependent on the rich government would be if the rich were their ONLY source of income as you advocate.


Or maybe the little people would pay enough to make it worthwhile to protect them, or at least, to not screw them wholesale.

Everyone's denunciation of everyone else's political system always seems to reduce to, "It wouldn't work."

I don't think Biq's way would work either, but I admit I'm not sure.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Little Biq Man
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 1100
Joined: Mar 17th, 2019
Re: Adam Schiff is Doing Something Great for the Nation. If . . .
Reply #82 - Nov 17th, 2019 at 8:17pm
Print Post  
kaz wrote on Nov 17th, 2019 at 3:42pm:
It's about scale.  Right now, even a billionaire can't call and say to arrest LBM on a trumped up charge because he wants to take your property that is adjacent to his. 


Yes, he can because:

kaz wrote on Nov 17th, 2019 at 2:51pm:
All governments are for sale.  It's the funny thing about money, it buys things. 


Yes, and in 2005, it bought Pfizer, the giant pharma corporation, the "right" to take an entire neighborhood of homes adjacent to its 24 acre complex in New London Connecticut.  It needed no trumped up charges, just easily purchased local government officials. 

However, the threat of imprisonment was certainly behind the government's use of force to take the homes.  Praise Allah that in our country, even an average middle-class woman who loves her little pink house has the right to take on a giant corporation and the government it owns.  To the Supreme court they went, thanks to the efforts of libertarian lawyers.  Real libertarians, not tax-and-spenders.

The court said, WTTE of, "Well, sure Pfizer can take Ms. Kelo's house!  They're rich, aren't they?"

And hey!  To bad they didn't have "loser pays."  Pfizer could have gotten all their court costs and lawyer fees out of the discounted sale of Ms. Kelo's house.  Yay, government!



  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
The Opposition
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Online

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 11995
Joined: Apr 30th, 2014
Re: Adam Schiff is Doing Something Great for the Nation. If . . .
Reply #83 - Nov 17th, 2019 at 8:27pm
Print Post  
Little Biq Man wrote on Nov 17th, 2019 at 8:17pm:
The court said, WTTE of, "Well, sure Pfizer can have Ms. Kelo's house!  They're rich, aren't they?"


And I agree with them, but I won't say why here. I will say that it's related to my epiphany in the bank thread about protecting property at any expense.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Little Biq Man
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 1100
Joined: Mar 17th, 2019
Re: Adam Schiff is Doing Something Great for the Nation. If . . .
Reply #84 - Nov 17th, 2019 at 8:37pm
Print Post  
The Opposition wrote on Nov 17th, 2019 at 8:27pm:
And I agree with them, but I won't say why here. I will say that it's related to my epiphany in the bank thread about protecting property at any expense.


That sounds interesting enough for its own thread.

I look forward to it!

What was the exact title of he "bank thread?"
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
kaz
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Minarchist

Posts: 9240
Location: Kazmania
Joined: Jun 6th, 2017
Re: Adam Schiff is Doing Something Great for the Nation. If . . .
Reply #85 - Nov 17th, 2019 at 8:49pm
Print Post  
Little Biq Man wrote on Nov 17th, 2019 at 8:17pm:
Yes, he can because:


Yes, and in 2005, it bought Pfizer, the giant pharma corporation, the "right" to take an entire neighborhood of homes adjacent to its 24 acre complex in New London Connecticut.  It needed no trumped up charges, just easily purchased local government officials. 

However, the threat of imprisonment was certainly behind the government's use of force to take the homes.  Praise Allah that in our country, even an average middle-class woman who loves her little pink house has the right to take on a giant corporation and the government it owns.  To the Supreme court they went, thanks to the efforts of libertarian lawyers.  Real libertarians, not tax-and-spenders.

The court said, WTTE of, "Well, sure Pfizer can have Ms. Kelo's house!  They're rich, aren't they?"




You're referring to Kelo versus New London.  I have brought that up many times.  Just FYI, it wasn't Pfizer, it was a developer.  But yes, it was using imminent (sic) domain to take property from one citizen and give it to another, which is one of the reasons I withdrew my consent to be governed by the Federal government.  The fifth amendment was another right of the people the Feds plowed over.

But no, it wasn't the same as a police force that answers to no one but the rich.  It's still impossible to take a socialist arguing for no government seriously
  

Contest winner:  I predicted Kaz' meltdown
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
The Opposition
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Online

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 11995
Joined: Apr 30th, 2014
Re: Adam Schiff is Doing Something Great for the Nation. If . . .
Reply #86 - Nov 17th, 2019 at 8:51pm
Print Post  
Little Biq Man wrote on Nov 17th, 2019 at 8:37pm:
That sounds interesting enough for its own thread.


It'll have to go in another forum.

Little Biq Man wrote on Nov 17th, 2019 at 8:37pm:
I look forward to it!

What was the exact title of he "bank thread?"


http://www.libertariansforum.com/cgi-bin/freedom/YaBB.pl?num=1568049585/0

Little Big Man wrote on Sep 11th, 2019 at 9:22am:
Unlike my imitator, I have no trouble at all answering that point (but I do acknowledge it is a good one).

It is true that banks are forbidden from reaching out and punishing people who take the bank's money, whether at gunpoint or by simply accepting an accidental gift.  But banks are not at all forbidden from having a policy requiring minimum wage tellers to ask their 3K per month assistant manager to supervise and double check when they handle transactions over one hundred K.  Banks are certainly not forbidden from hiring more qualified and trustworthy people by offering higher wages.  Nor are they forbidden from buying insurance against losses caused by poor management.

Banks don't hire better workers, because hiring a thousand better workers nationwide for even as little as a thousand dollars more per year would cost a million dollars, far more than they lost in this mistake.  Financially speaking, that is a very wise choice.  But since they do not share with me the wealth they create by paying minimum wage to people who handle hundreds of thousands of dollars, I should not have to share the risk they take by doing that.

If I sell my used car to my neighbor for 10K cash and put it in my bank account, the bank will report me immediately to the central government as obviously a drug dealer, money launderer or financier of terrorism.  Since 10K is enough to render me guilty until proven innocent, then twelve times that amount should be enough to trigger some level of fiduciary concern on the part of the bank's management.

So, I cannot go along with the idea that the bank's claim of victimhood means that it must have unlimited access to my paycheck, my real property and my personal property in order to spend upward of a million dollars imprisoning the people that the bank accidentally enriched, however unfairly.


The Opposition wrote on Sep 11th, 2019 at 10:13am:
And I could hire a bodyguard, which would presumably prevent many potential instances of me being shot. The fact that I don't is not grounds to deny justice to my murderer, even though it will cost a shitton to imprison him.


Burnsy: 🦗
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
kaz
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Minarchist

Posts: 9240
Location: Kazmania
Joined: Jun 6th, 2017
Re: Adam Schiff is Doing Something Great for the Nation. If . . .
Reply #87 - Nov 17th, 2019 at 11:05pm
Print Post  
Little Biq Man wrote on Nov 17th, 2019 at 1:06pm:
The fact that his father paid no income tax the previous year made it very credible that they were wealthy.



You do like making your shit up as you go, but the only way they paid zero income taxes was if they owned their own business and were writing off a bunch of losses/investments.  You can't sustain that because eventually you make too much money to keep covering it in tax losses or you go broke if you're actually losing money.

Being the Statist that you are, of course you want them to pay taxes on just getting their investment back before they make a profit, you've repeated that several times.

But in the end, again, you being full of shit, on the average, the wealthy pay a FAR higher rate of income tax than anyone else.  That you base your argument on outliers is the disingenuous kind of person that you are
  

Contest winner:  I predicted Kaz' meltdown
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Little Biq Man
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 1100
Joined: Mar 17th, 2019
Re: Adam Schiff is Doing Something Great for the Nation. If . . .
Reply #88 - Nov 18th, 2019 at 5:45am
Print Post  
kaz wrote on Nov 17th, 2019 at 8:49pm:
You're referring to Kelo versus New London.  I have brought that up many times.  Just FYI, it wasn't Pfizer, it was a developer.  But yes, it was using imminent (sic) domain to take property from one citizen and give it to another, which is one of the reasons I withdrew my consent to be governed by the Federal government.  The fifth amendment was another right of the people the Feds plowed over.


The developer was a non-profit that had gone dormant, but was re-activated by the local government for the purpose of doing Pfizer's bidding.

Don't be so gullible, McFly!

Quote:
But no, it wasn't the same as a police force that answers to no one but the rich.  It's still impossible to take a socialist arguing for no government seriously


Nothing is the same as anything else, that is not an argument; it's meaningless.

I never advocated a system in which the police answer only to the rich.  We have that now.  The rich won't voluntarily pay enough to finance the entire police force when private security would be so much cheaper.  Local people would pay for a local police force.  They would even volunteer to donate time one day a week if they weren't working sixty hours a week to keep up with taxes.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Little Biq Man
Libertarian Freedom Member
*****
Offline

Libertarian's Forum

Posts: 1100
Joined: Mar 17th, 2019
Re: Adam Schiff is Doing Something Great for the Nation. If . . .
Reply #89 - Nov 18th, 2019 at 5:47am
Print Post  
kaz wrote on Nov 17th, 2019 at 11:05pm:
You do like making your shit up as you go, but the only way they paid zero income taxes was if they owned their own business and were writing off a bunch of losses/investments.  You can't sustain that because eventually you make too much money to keep covering it in tax losses or you go broke if you're actually losing money.

Being the Statist that you are, of course you want them to pay taxes on just getting their investment back before they make a profit, you've repeated that several times.

But in the end, again, you being full of shit, on the average, the wealthy pay a FAR higher rate of income tax than anyone else.  That you base your argument on outliers is the disingenuous kind of person that you are


Your confidence in the IRS truthfulness and its ability to make them  rich bastards pay is a sure sign of a liberal democrat.

  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 ... 7 8 [9] 10 11 12
Send TopicPrint
 
Libertarian's ForumLibertarian's ForumFreedom Forum › Adam Schiff is Doing Something Great for the Nation. If . . .
Libertarian's Forum

Libertarian's Forum Information Rules, Agreement and Privacy Policy