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Poll Question: Ivory Farms
bars   pie

Total Autonomy for Ivory Farms    
  2 (66.7%)
Some Protection for Elephants    
  1 (33.3%)




Total votes: 3
This Poll ends automatically in 6 days, 7 hours and 28 minutes.
« Created by: The Opposition on: Dec 1st, 2019 at 2:04pm »
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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Should An Ivory Business be Allowed To... (Read 686 times)
The Opposition
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Should An Ivory Business be Allowed To...
Dec 1st, 2019 at 2:04pm
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Should an ivory business be allowed to raise and breed elephants purely for ivory?

What if the conditions on ivory farms are deemed inhumane? Should the elephants being mistreated be rescued?

WARNING: GRAPHIC



In other words, when animals are treated like this, should a business be allowed to do so, or should the government stop it?

(To clarify, I am still talking about elephants, but at this level of cruelty.)
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Little Biq Man
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Re: Should An Ivory Business be Allowed To...
Reply #1 - Dec 1st, 2019 at 2:38pm
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I abhor cruelty to animals.  But not as much as I abhor a government that points guns at us to control our behavior.

Great thread idea, I look forward to grown up answers from those capable.

  
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kaz
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Re: Should An Ivory Business be Allowed To...
Reply #2 - Dec 1st, 2019 at 2:41pm
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Little Biq Man wrote on Dec 1st, 2019 at 2:38pm:
I abhor cruelty to animals.  But not as much as I abhor a government that points guns at us to control our behavior.

Great thread idea, I look forward to grown up answers from those capable.



I always like when the site troll who literally brought family insults and changing quote boxes to the site chides that other people aren't capable of a grown up answer, LOL.  Even funnier, you use the sock who's first post on the site was to attack my family to do it.  Animals are living animals who can feel pain.  There's nothing unlibertarian at all about protecting them


  

Contest winner:  I predicted Kaz' meltdown
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The Opposition
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Re: Should An Ivory Business be Allowed To...
Reply #3 - Dec 1st, 2019 at 3:11pm
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kaz wrote on Dec 1st, 2019 at 2:41pm:
Animals are living animals who can feel pain.  There's nothing unlibertarian at all about protecting them


I agree. So what should happen to that fur business?

Should they be forced by government to kill their animals more humanely (by captive bolt stunning, for example)?

Should the animals be removed from them? This is my main question.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Jeff
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Re: Should An Ivory Business be Allowed To...
Reply #4 - Dec 1st, 2019 at 5:57pm
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The Opposition wrote on Dec 1st, 2019 at 2:04pm:
Should an ivory business be allowed to raise and breed elephants purely for ivory?

Yes. A free market in privately produced ivory prevents elephants from being poached into extinction for their ivory.

I'ts a choice, not a stand alone moral issue.
  

"Free hate speech"
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Jeff
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Re: Should An Ivory Business be Allowed To...
Reply #5 - Dec 1st, 2019 at 6:00pm
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kaz wrote on Dec 1st, 2019 at 2:41pm:
Animals are living animals who can feel pain.  There's nothing unlibertarian at all about protecting them


Well, dead animals aren't living.

It's also libertarian to raise them for meat, and milk, leather and fur, all that stuff, and to buy the products that are produced. Smiley
  

"Free hate speech"
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Little Biq Man
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Re: Should An Ivory Business be Allowed To...
Reply #6 - Dec 1st, 2019 at 6:43pm
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kaz wrote on Dec 1st, 2019 at 2:41pm:
I always like when the site troll who literally brought family insults and changing quote boxes to the site chides that other people aren't capable of a grown up answer, LOL.  Even funnier, you use the sock who's first post on the site was to attack my family to do it.  Animals are living animals who can feel pain.  There's nothing unlibertarian at all about protecting them


By your definition of libertarian, sure.  Your definition of libertarianism means that government uses guns to control the population, not the other way around.


  
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Jeff
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Re: Should An Ivory Business be Allowed To...
Reply #7 - Dec 1st, 2019 at 6:49pm
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Little Biq Man wrote on Dec 1st, 2019 at 6:43pm:
By your definition of libertarian, sure.  Your definition of libertarianism means that government uses guns to control the population...
Shooting people so they can't reproduce? Democratic Socialists have a history of doing that... Shocked

Anyway, libertarians don't mind governments using guns to control violent individuals. Smiley

Are you imagining that the Chinese soldiers and security police subduing the people of Hong Kong are libertarians? Cheesy
  

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The Opposition
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Re: Should An Ivory Business be Allowed To...
Reply #8 - Dec 1st, 2019 at 6:51pm
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I didn't take "control" of the population to mean that.

I left Kaz a correct answer, he just didn't take it. He should have said that the ivory business should have total autonomy to abuse elephants.

I would have asked why he doesn't think a private individual should have the right to abuse their tiger, but he could have just said, lol ur absolutism, idiot, and I'd have been laughed off the stage.

But because he chose against business, he will now be laughed off the stage.

Protip: If you're trying to be consistent, you're not a libertarian.
  

This moral relativism of yours is exactly what lets government take this freedom, then that freedom, until we have lost them all.
-SnarkySack
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Jeff
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Re: Should An Ivory Business be Allowed To...
Reply #9 - Dec 1st, 2019 at 7:03pm
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The Opposition wrote on Dec 1st, 2019 at 6:51pm:
I didn't take "control" of the population to mean that.

You think he meant to say "tyrannize" the people?
  

"Free hate speech"
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