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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) It Appears that the War with Iran has Finally Started (Read 1681 times)
kaz
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Re: It Appears that the War with Iran has Finally Started
Reply #60 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 12:02pm
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SkyChief wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 11:55am:
But they blame the US for putting Iran in a situation where this kind of mistake was possible.

IOW, if Trump had not ordered the hit on Soleimani, Iran would not have been fearful of an attack by the Great Satan. 

That Iranian radar operator would not have mistaken the Ukrainian Airlines plane to be an incoming missile.

I predict that will be their excuse after the investigations are concluded.



It seemed from their most recent statements they want it to go away.  I'm sure they will give lip service to what you say, but no one already is really buying it.

What I can't believe is they didn't just shut down commercial aviation once they launched the attack until things were stable.  That was their boner in this.

The good thing is they proved they are afraid of Trump.  They shot to miss and were still worried that he'd light them up
  

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kaz
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Re: It Appears that the War with Iran has Finally Started
Reply #61 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 12:04pm
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SkyChief wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 11:55am:
But they blame the US for putting Iran in a situation where this kind of mistake was possible.

IOW, if Trump had not ordered the hit on Soleimani, Iran would not have been fearful of an attack by the Great Satan. 

That Iranian radar operator would not have mistaken the Ukrainian Airlines plane to be an incoming missile.

I predict that will be their excuse after the investigations are concluded.



Also, if this is the nature of predictions you're making, no wonder you're 27 of 29.  This is so butt obvious.   Of course they will do that.  If these are the predictions you're making, how did you possibly miss two?
  

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SkyChief
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Re: It Appears that the War with Iran has Finally Started
Reply #62 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 2:58pm
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kaz wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 12:04pm:
Also, if this is the nature of predictions you're making, no wonder you're 27 of 29.  This is so butt obvious.   Of course they will do that.  If these are the predictions you're making, how did you possibly miss two?
One of the predictions had a deadline.  The other was I predicted that Hillary would win.   Embarrassed

I also predicted that Trump would send tanks into Syria.   Now it looks like that's unlikely to happen, but I'm not gonna take the loss until Trump leaves office in 2024.   Smiley
  

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kaz
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Re: It Appears that the War with Iran has Finally Started
Reply #63 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 3:19pm
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SkyChief wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 2:58pm:
One of the predictions had a deadline.  The other was I predicted that Hillary would win.   Embarrassed

I also predicted that Trump would send tanks into Syria.   Now it looks like that's unlikely to happen, but I'm not gonna take the loss until Trump leaves office in 2024.   Smiley


Yes, you and I bet on that one.  I mean we didn't bet anything other than who's right.  But agreed you don't need to take the loss on that as long as Trump is still President.

I think he showed in Iran though he doesn't want war.   He took the economic sanctions route when Iran shot back and missed on purpose rather than another military strike.   He gave them the out
  

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Jeff
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Re: It Appears that the War with Iran has Finally Started
Reply #64 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 5:40pm
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Are we at war with Iran, or not?
  

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SkyChief
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Re: It Appears that the War with Iran has Finally Started
Reply #65 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 5:48pm
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Jeff wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 5:40pm:
Are we at war with Iran, or not?

Not.

Only Congress (Senate) has the constitutional authority to declare war.

The president may veto a declaration of war, however the Senate may override the veto.
  

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Jeff
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Re: It Appears that the War with Iran has Finally Started
Reply #66 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 6:27pm
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SkyChief wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 5:48pm:
Not.

Only Congress (Senate) has the constitutional authority to declare war.

The president may veto a declaration of war, however the Senate may override the veto.
Perhaps we aren't at war legally, but are we actually at war? Assassinating a General is an act of war, isn't it?

Is it now the precedent that the President, at his discretion,  can make war on anyone, whether we are legally at war, or not?

That's a dangerous precedent, and very wrong.
  

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SkyChief
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Re: It Appears that the War with Iran has Finally Started
Reply #67 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 7:12pm
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Jeff wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 6:27pm:
Perhaps we aren't at war legally, but are we actually at war? Assassinating a General is an act of war, isn't it?
Technically no.  Only Congress can declare war.

Jeff wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 6:27pm:
Is it now the precedent that the President, at his discretion,  can make war on anyone, whether we are legally at war, or not?

That's a dangerous precedent, and very wrong.
Since the 1960s, presidents have used executive privilege to order military ops without Congress approval.

In 1964, LBJ commiitted US troops to engage the north Vietnamese.  Congress LATER approved, but the initial deployment was made before any authorization came from the Senate.

In 1971, Congress repealed the Gulf of Tonkin Resolution, but Richard Nixon continued to wage war in Vietnam.

In 1973, The War Powers Act (50 U.S.C. 1541–1548) became law to check the U.S. president's power to commit the United States to an armed conflict without the consent of the U.S. Congress.

In 1983,  Ronald Reagan invaded Grenada in an effort to push aside the Cuban-supported government there. Congress was never consulted.

In 1999, Slick Willie ignored the War Powers Act and ordered air strikes/bombing raids in Kosovo, never consulting Congress.

Between 2008 and 2016, Obama ordered over 500 drone strikes which killed hundreds of innocent civilians. All without Congress approval.   He was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize.   Wait..  wh.. HUH?  Huh
  

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SkyChief
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Re: It Appears that the War with Iran has Finally Started
Reply #68 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 7:38pm
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Earlier today, Kentucky Senator Rand Paul said:

"Our Founding Fathers wanted it [the decision to order military strikes] to remain in Congress and make it difficult to go to war.  I think we’ve been drifting away from that for a long time."

Indeed we have.   Since 1964, in fact.
  

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kaz
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Re: It Appears that the War with Iran has Finally Started
Reply #69 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 7:46pm
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Jeff wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 5:40pm:
Are we at war with Iran, or not?


Hardly
  

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