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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Individual investment Primer (Read 256 times)
Jeff
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Re: Individual investment Primer
Reply #10 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 5:42pm
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kaz wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 5:15pm:
So he works for free?  You don't write him a check and he doesn't sell you loaded funds?   Wow, sounds like a great guy.   How does he eat?
The same way your stockbroker does, unless you are one.
  

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kaz
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Re: Individual investment Primer
Reply #11 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 7:57pm
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Jeff wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 5:42pm:
The same way your stockbroker does, unless you are one.


I manage my own portfolio and that of several members of my family.  I wouldn't pay a salesman to do something that I can do myself.  And I'm an expert in it, they are salesmen.

Anyway, typically funds that pay the broker charge 1.5-2 percent in fees.

For just $1M, just one percent savings is $10K a year.   That means over a short period of time, I'm saving my family and myself hundreds of thousands in investment fees.  I've done that since the 90s.  It means I've saved us easily a million dollars in fees. 

You don't have the knowledge I do as you love to demonstrate, but I gave you a solution.  Hire someone and write them a check.  Have them give you a plan that YOU implement in low cost funds.  My favorite is Vanguard.  You can probably do it for $1-2K a year or so.

I don't charge my family members who I do that for anything though.

Care or not, but it's real money.  I like screwing financial salesmen because it's such a shaddy industry.

If saving over $10K a year for just a $1M portfolio isn't worth it to you, then whatever.  It's your money
  

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kaz
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Re: Individual investment Primer
Reply #12 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 8:00pm
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Interestingly, this ties into our Fed discussion.

Financial salesman charge exorbinant fees.  You don't notice because you're making money anyway.  The market keeps going up.  They just take a big chunk of your earnings, your principle still grows.

That's what the Fed is doing to the economy.  It's not crashing because they keep their stealing to taking a percentage of the growth of the economy.  So you don't notice.

The Fed and financial salesmen are experts in taking as much as they can without you noticing
  

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SkyChief
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Re: Individual investment Primer
Reply #13 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 8:07pm
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kaz wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 5:15pm:
So he works for free?  You don't write him a check and he doesn't sell you loaded funds?   Wow, sounds like a great guy.   How does he eat?

Of course my funds are loaded, meaning that my investment planner makes a fee on the funds I'm in.

But he only "sold" them to me the day that I established the portfolio.   Sales ended on that day.
  

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kaz
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Re: Individual investment Primer
Reply #14 - Jan 12th, 2020 at 9:43pm
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SkyChief wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 8:07pm:
Of course my funds are loaded, meaning that my investment planner makes a fee on the funds I'm in.

But he only "sold" them to me the day that I established the portfolio.   Sales ended on that day.


Right.  But then continue to charge high management fees.  Have you Googled your funds to see what your management fees are?

Some of the ETFs I invest in:

Vanguard Total Bond (BND), expenses %0.05 (that's 1/20th of one percent)

Vanguard 500 (VOO), expenses %0.03 (that's roughly 1/33th of one percent).

The most expensive ETF I have is Emerging Markets (VWOB), %0.32 percent (roughly 1/3 of one percent).

Second most expensive are VG REIT (VNQ) and VG International REIT (VNQI) both are 0.12%.

My average is less than %0.1 (1/10th of one percent).

If you're paying 1% on one million (and it's probably more), that means you're paying $10,000 a year and I'm paying less than $1,000 a year.

The difference is dramatic.  But you have to find a "fee only" adviser and you have to do the actual trades yourself.  But you save a boat load of money


  

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Jeff
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Re: Individual investment Primer
Reply #15 - Jan 13th, 2020 at 8:19am
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kaz wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 7:57pm:
I manage my own portfolio and that of several members of my family.
Good for you, but you still pay transaction fees to stockbrokers when you by and sell.
  

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Jeff
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Re: Individual investment Primer
Reply #16 - Jan 13th, 2020 at 8:20am
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kaz wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 8:00pm:
Financial salesman charge exorbinant fees.
Perhaps some do... What's "exorbitant"?
  

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kaz
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Re: Individual investment Primer
Reply #17 - Jan 13th, 2020 at 8:42am
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Jeff wrote on Jan 13th, 2020 at 8:19am:
Good for you, but you still pay transaction fees to stockbrokers when you by and sell.


Yes.  I told you there are transaction fees, you stupid fvck.   I pay LOWER fees.  I don't not pay fees.

Paying LESS is good, shit for brains.

I also pay management fees.  I just pay LOWER management fees.  In fact the post you responded to listed the management fees that I pay.  I just pay LESS.

What is wrong with you?  Seriously?
  

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Jeff
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Re: Individual investment Primer
Reply #18 - Jan 13th, 2020 at 10:32am
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kaz wrote on Jan 13th, 2020 at 8:42am:
Yes.  I told you there are transaction fees.   I pay LOWER fees.  I don't not pay fees.

I consider that the money I spend to have my IRA professionally managed is well worth it. Smiley

You might be paying lower fees (or you might not), but there is a cost to you in time spent to manage your own portfolio.

Since I already have plenty of money, and I'm old, my time is more valuable to me than the management fees I pay. Besides, experience has shown that I'm only average at choosing investments.


  

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SkyChief
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Re: Individual investment Primer
Reply #19 - Jan 13th, 2020 at 11:59am
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kaz wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 9:43pm:
  Have you Googled your funds to see what your management fees are?
I haven't.

What I don't know won't hurt me.

kaz wrote on Jan 12th, 2020 at 9:43pm:
If you're paying 1% on one million (and it's probably more), that means you're paying $10,000 a year and I'm paying less than $1,000 a year.

The difference is dramatic.  But you have to find a "fee only" adviser and you have to do the actual trades yourself.  But you save a boat load of money
I really suck at trading.   You're offering excellent advice, I'm sure.  I'm a lazy old coot who likes to bury gold in the ground.
  

Governments will always devise ways to deprive an honest man of his money or property, and claim that it's legal.
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